Why Discipline is So Hard

Welcome to Wabi Sabi, the art of imperfection. Jim, it's great to see you. It's been a couple of weeks. I've been traveling, you've been traveling, and it's been great. But I got to say, know, like a whole podcast has been about imperfection. I was talking to my, you know, good friend, Chachi PT and Claude yesterday, having a conversation about, you know, what, what am I getting stuck on? And it was talking about and they

Lockwise, right? Lockwise. Yeah. Yeah.

I said, you know, ask me hard questions. And one of the things like, okay, what's the one thing that's stopping you? And I just realized I'm like, the one thing is stopping me is the aim for perfection and not releasing things. And I'm like, oh, man, this I'm just like, thank you. You know, I can't remember who was I speaking with, whether it be Jenny or Donna, whoever I named my, my AI uh agents to be. But anyways, it was that of imperfection. But I gotta say this past month has been a crazy

You

moments of imperfection. I'll only start by sort of suggesting, we usually don't date these, but let's just say it is, the CrossFit Open, which is for those people who don't know, every year the CrossFit releases an open that is basically inviting all the CrossFit athletes to participate. And it's really meant, I mean obviously there's the pro, the professionals, and you gotta win your regionals, and then from there you go to your Asia Pacific or Europe, and then from those they, crown the champions and then they go to like this one big game, right? Once a year. Now I have no illusions. making anywhere close to any of those things. My goal is just to maybe just finish, you know, one of those, uh, exercise. So the way CrossFit is done is that they usually release sort of three exercises over three weeks. And so they release it say on a Thursday and you have Friday, Saturday, Sunday or Monday to complete that exercise. um And they you score it so you always get judged by whoever you're usually someone from your your box or your gym and then Then you score it and then you kind of rank, know worldwide and stuff really, you know You don't really care about the number is really more just a challenging your own fitness, right? So um and so there is usually released on the Thursday So you only have like you only got a couple of days to kind of complete this you don't know one knows exactly what it is and it's usually a special announcement so I've done these CrossFit champions, these opens before and they're challenging, of course, because, you know, they got to aim for the pros, but also for people who just like any regular person should be able to do it. And but this year was I haven't done I haven't done one in a while just because I'm always seems to be traveling around January, February and March and always kind of conflicts. I'm just never ready for I just, you know, with New Year's. But this year, our particular box like my gym, here that I go to in Portugal, was the number one most participant gym in the world last year. Yeah, in the world. Like we're talking, like we beat, yeah, yeah, yeah. Last year I didn't even do it, right? So that's without me. Like I'm not that I'm a big name. But this year, I could have been better. I know, I didn't even join.

What? Yeah, wow. That's without you. And you didn't put that on. I'm just saying it could have been even better. uh

And then so they announced, so what they did was that, they have three, right? So it's 26.1, 26.2, 26.3, and they do this worldwide. So it's broadcast worldwide, and 26.2, which is the second exercise where it's gonna be released, and they're gonna announce it in my gym. And I'm like, oh, okay, this is awesome. Like, Portugal's gonna be put on the map, and it's gonna be a worldwide announcement. I thought, this is gonna be special, this is amazing. And so I go, well, I gotta, participate like this year, I just gotta join. And I know I'm seem like I'm making excuses and I am. I'm just gonna tell you bluntly I'm making excuses. You know, this is at the end of January. I think we talked about this. I was sick, right, until Christmas. So my training was all over the place coming back into the new year. Then I went to Japan in February, right, for 11 days. Jet lagged. Didn't do a single thing other than walk for maybe 20 kilometers a day. Didn't do any exercise. I come back for like one or two, I came back for six days, then I had to go to Morocco to run a retreat. So in between all that, 26.1 gets released, I do it and it is like the worst exercise for me because I'm short, I'm five, seven and it was like freaking wall balls and I don't have legs, I got ping pong legs. It was so bad, Jim, on that first exercise, I gotta tell you. that you have to hit this line. And I decided to do it like what they recommend to weight. And I don't train with this weight. And this will all make sense in a second. I don't train with this weight because I've always come like, oh, all year, last couple of years, I've been like, yeah, I don't need to go that heavy. I'm just going to go. But when you haven't trained in like a particular weight, and then you go and do that weight on like a competition kind of against the clock, it is heavy. And you forget how heavy it is and how tiring it is.

Mm. against the clock. Yeah. uh

and I'm just doing these things. And Jim, for you, would have been fine. You would have just been maybe just like toss it up there, right? For me, I gotta go all the way. And I had about, so you have to get across the If you don't get across the line, they say, the judge will say no rep. I had about 15, I think, about no reps. So I did 15 freaking wall balls that didn't count whatsoever. At the end, I literally had to like jump, like jump. I'm already fatigued. I'm jumping to get the ball, even just to touch the damn line.

I'll just put you down.

Right? So I'm like, I'm never going to get anywhere with this. So my point is, that one, I was ill-prepared. ah My fitness level is absolutely shot. I have no cardio whatsoever at the moment. Number two, I learned a valuable lesson, which is I gotta stop like lightning. If I want to like improve, can't wish it. to improve without actually putting in the work. And I know it sounds so stupid to say it out loud, but that's the reality. Like I've been cruising in my workouts to get it done rather than actually be humble enough to kind of go, I'm gonna suck during the training and I'm gonna suck during practice and be okay with that rather than trying to like, oh, I did okay today, you know? And then just like lull myself into this false security that I'm fit.

Hmm.

knowing that full well that I'm actually not, I'm just fooling myself. And that's kind of the leaning and the topic that I wanna kinda go into is like, how often are we fooling ourselves ah that we're actually doing something but we're really not. It's almost like we're keeping busy in our lives, but we're actually not moving anywhere. Like I've done that so many times, like I'm busy, but am I actually moving forward? So that's my.

Hmm. Yeah. That's a good, that's a good point because CrossFit, uh, there's so many parallels between CrossFit and Jiu-Jitsu, right? Because you can, it all, it, all the truth shows up on the mat or on, on basically when you're doing that workout where all the could have, would have should have, or the, the, the areas where you hadn't fully been present or given all of yourself or been away, shows up and I get it. I get it. I, know, you have a couple of weeks off and it feels like how far did I decline and, it's your, your aerobic capacity. And that's the biggest thing that I've noticed. And I would imagine it's the same thing with you as well too, where 20 kilometers is interesting. said, I walked around and I didn't exercise and you walk in 20 kilometers a day. that is different to your baseline and you're walking 20 kilometers a day by conventional standards. Most people will be jumping from, from, from the rooftops. with that level of activity, because your sport, your, your activity demands more of yourself that doesn't cut it. And so I found the same thing, but sometimes, you know, sometimes it's appropriate to regulate what you're doing. You know, like if you're, if you recovering or if you, if you're just getting back into it, totally get it. And in the past, I've been guilty of going too hard, too quick, but there's also that other parallel where you're just coasting and you've got to go, well, why am I coasting? And Uh, you know, we, always talk about the importance of a coach in multiple areas. The best, uh, the best way that I have ever performed was when, know, when I've had personal trainer who, uh, makes me do the things that number one, I don't want to do, but number two, that I would stop earlier. And so they know sometimes they can see within you, me, everybody else, there's another gear, another level that we're just not accessing because we either coming up against our own. self our limitations or just we haven't pushed ourselves. um, that's, that's what I want to add to that. And let's just keep expanding that for conversation sake.

And that's the exact truth. It's like, and there is the dark side, right? The dark side is like, you know, I come out of these things, like yesterday was the first day, you know, we're out of the open now. And the first day I'm like, no, I'm going to go in those heavyweights. I'm going to go in those. What this workout calls for is 22 and a half kilos. And that's what we're doing. Right. And then I, but I didn't read it right. I thought it was singles. It was actually doubles. So which means I'm like, I got to do a freaking devil press with both of these damn things.

Yeah. Yeah.

I'm like, no, no, I'm committed now. guess I'm on a new year, in a sense of going, no, I'm going to do what's the recommended weight. And no excuses, then I'm 50, whatever, I'm just going to do this weight. And I'm like, I'm dying. I'm freaking dying on these things. But the reality is, you can't go the opposite way. The dark side is that I know in a couple weeks' time that I'm going to feel so fatigued out that I'm gonna go, have to bring this down or I'm gonna injure myself. And so therefore like there's that fine line of like knowing to push but also knowing to like, okay, you've done some heavy work for a couple of weeks or a month or whatever. Now is to maybe just like give yourself some body to recover, right? And so what I think I've done in the past, I've done too much of the other ways. Like, oh, my shoulder has been kind of sore so I'm just gonna do it a little bit. But then that becomes my baseline. I just gotta like recognize that in myself, which is so hard. And like you said, the coach is, that's what you need, right? So sometimes it's like having someone who can see your potential and push you. without like, and not thinking that you know better, and this is the challenge sometimes, is that we, all of us, think that we know better. But we're not seeing the downward effects, and this is what I'm missing, right? What I didn't see within myself was how long I've been doing this for. I've been doing this for at least two years. Like, sure, I show up, I show up to the gym, and I'm not saying that I don't work out at all, but I recognize, I like, I haven't worked at that level. like out of that capacity for such a long time that it really has like affected me to grow, to be better than I currently am. And I had to reassess and I think that one of the things that I said this year was that I was gonna go into, I'm gonna enter a competition, not to like win or anything else, but just to enter a competition, to put myself in that situation. And that day, that first workout, I'm like, I don't wanna do this. Like literally, it was only two movements.

Hmm.

And it's the two movements I hate them, like one of the two movements I hate the most. It's like, I suck at both of these. And I was like wrestling all day trying to go rationalize whether I should or shouldn't, I'm not fit, da da da da, I had no training. But it's almost like, for me, was like, who am I competing against here? But it's like, who cares? No one's like watching me. It's all in my head that I'm not gonna do as well as those regular guys I work out with.

Hmm. Hmm.

but it was all in my head and I realized I was just like battling, wasted so much energy the night before worrying about something that I really didn't have to, which is, it's weird how our human brain goes. Even though you're not competing against anybody else but yourself, you still cannot help but worrying about what other people think.

Totally. Yeah, totally. Totally. You know, I remember one other thing that you said at the start of the year was an intention to ship more and ship more regularly. And, know, I, uh, it's, it's interesting that what the realizations are sometimes, cause sometimes you get these, um, situations where you go to a CrossFit comp and you're not performing to the level you are. And that gives you the realization of the reality of here's where I'm at.

Mm-hmm.

Uh, this is where I thought I was. Oh, there's a whole era I had no idea on, but it can happen in other areas of life and world. Right? So yesterday, yesterday, day before yesterday, was coaching a client and does some phenomenal videos on, on, um, for, for, for his, for his business. And they're really good. And I said, Hey, I really love your videos. Haven't seen you do them for a while. How are you going with it? Because he, I'm going to get them. Okay. It looks and sounds like a great idea. Just make sure you work on those. Cause they're helpful. goes, awesome. goes, look, can I just ask you a question? I go, yeah, sure. goes, You used to do a whole lot of them as well too. I haven't seen you. If you've been doing them, I just missing them. I went, Whoa. Okay. So, so yesterday I posted my first video and today I posted my second one because I needed, you know, it was that kick in the backside Lawrence, you know, like that real life, the reality check, because sometimes, you know, when you're talking about your, your training, like I remember, you know, and I haven't had a PT.

Ha ha ha. Well done.

Um, for a while, because I go to structured classes for jujitsu and that's part of the reason why. Um, but when I had my PT, the first thing he always did was let's do a self-checking where you at at a 10 and I'd go, I'm a nine in my energy and physicality. Great. Awesome. I know now what I can work with. Right. And so if I was rocked up and I had a three out of 10 energy levels, he calibrated the workout based on what I could handle so that it didn't overwhelm, but I could still be challenged. And then the next day I turn up and if I'm feeling more energetic, then he would ups up level. But there was no point. Like if, if I was saying, Hey, I'm a nine out of 10 and I'm giving a three out of 10 effort, he knew at somewhere, somewhere there's, there's some invisible hand that's holding back. And it was a case of pushing me through something that I didn't actually realize I was putting up as an obstacle. So that to me was the blind spot that I needed in that capacity. And I get it now. And I imagine you have as well too, where you might have a Some of the instructors or coaches will go, Hey, you did that really well. What happened? You pulled back. You're not doing as much as you're. And sometimes it's a word or it's an observation from someone that you bump into yourself and suddenly go, hang on a sec. That's, that's not me.

Yeah, definitely. I have a tendency of, I'm pretty good at judging my energy level and going how hard to push, especially when I've been traveling so much. mean, this year has really honestly been one of the most disruptive start of the year in terms of stop, start, stop, start. I haven't been able to string more than two weeks of just consistent workout schedule, which is really weird. And I didn't realize how much travel disrupts that rhythm.

It does you just, you just got to do your HRV measures. And that says, you know, have you traveled and, and it does, throws your whole rhythm and systems out and, you've been traveling in different time zones too. So it's not just a travel and I'm going from Portugal to Spain and then the same timeframe. When you're going to, know, to Japan that that messes with your whole body clock.

Yeah. And it didn't realize how much uh it actually affected me until like now I reflect back. like, yeah, like those first couple of workouts I came back was really, I almost like threw up almost like a couple of times. And I just thought, okay, I'm really out of shape. But when I actually reflect back on this recent trip that I did, cause it was same time zone. No, was just like, it was just fatigue. Like it's just fatigue and all these images, like sort of all the stuff that was going on behind the scenes.

Yeah.

Because I feel relatively pretty good right now, but it took me a while like it took me how I get to this baseline and and that's the thing to travel everybody sort of talks about us so much fun traveling like my daughter says oh Because I I told her might actually the next three months is actually even worse like my travel schedule for the next three months is ridiculous and And for she's like oh so much fun. He goes no. I actually no no, it's not

Hmm. Hmm.

Like it's the amount of disruption into my workflow, my, my, my workout flow is, is not great. And I don't know how to like, you know, I know how to, like, it's just more about putting it into a priority, but I'm already foreseeing, um, challenges that ahead of me. And like, I, I have about a third, I mean, I got to travel this weekend, but at least only for a weekend, but I got about two week, the three week run where I have no travel. It's like, I'm so thankful. I am literally thankful just like there's this straight run. And I think I attribute this almost to the same thing around work, right? we're dealing with businesses or in our life, oftentimes we want to get somewhere, we have a goal and we have a vision. But the problem is we're always got fires always popping up everywhere in the business. And it's like, we just can't get enough momentum to really... or put ourselves in a position to really gain that traction and that flow to get anything accomplished because these fires kind of keep on popping up. And now going back on that, one of the reasons why is because I know I'm not protecting my time. I'm not protecting the flow time that I need to have because I'm allowing those fires to kind of creep up and I'm allowing those things to really... um take priority over my own priority. And that's usually the thing that I see the most is that I know, but my biggest flaw is that I let other things take more control over what I actually need to do. And I'm almost avoiding doing those things.

Okay. So why do think you do that?

um I do that is because one is it's I know the amount of work and deep work I need to do and I find that I I'm okay to do it when I'm inspired to do it like I'm excited but I don't put it first so what I do is I put it like later on the day and that's when my the energy and the momentum required to do it isn't as strong. And so therefore I will find excuses um to do that. And then I think I mentioned this to you before, which is a couple of months ago, what I realized is that I don't have the right environment. so if I don't, the environment, if I'm just here in my office, I got too much distractions here. Like, you know, I've got a distraction with, you know, all these other things I have capable of or.

So.

distractions with, know, oh, Karen's like, oh, I'm to go walk the dog. And, you know, there's that part of me and goes, oh, I got to do the husband thing. You know, I should really go spend some time. And so there goes 45 minutes, right? Like yesterday was perfect. I had this whole afternoon cleared. I decided to walk the dog with my wife, came back. I'm like, OK, I got a good 90 minutes, two hours before I got to go pick up the kids. And I get a message from an old client of mine. said, hey, I know it's last minute, but I'm in town.

Hmm. Hmm.

Do you want to join us for lunch? And I'm like, okay, I haven't actually I've never met him because he's from Canada. Right. So I've never actually, you know, I've coached him for years, but I've never actually met him in person. And he's literally just 10 minutes from where I am now. I was like, I should probably go meet. But again, like, that's unexpected. I'm not saying it was the wrong call, but it's just one of like those things happen. Right.

Alright. Yep. Yep.

and these unscheduled, not unscheduled fires, we'll call it, because not it wasn't a fire, but it's just like it distracts, and because I'm not carving out the time. And yeah, certain people will be more disciplined. I just, not. And, but yeah, there's definitely the purpose of doing it.

But, and I, and I get that, I get that because sometimes if there's an area that we don't like, I don't have potato chips in my house. Cause if I do it's, they're going to get slaughtered big time. Right. So I have to create friction between me and potato chips. Right. I like, I like playing. like playing. uh just.

Mmm. What's your favorite flavor? All right, come on. Just plain. Jim, you are so plain. Come on. Seriously, plain potato chips? Oh my God. How did I not?

I don't mind potato chips. don't mind them. I can't handle salt and vinegar chips. Uh, I don't like them at all. Um, yeah, I'm fine. You know, I'm not a, I'm not a foodie. I'm not a food connoisseur, uh, like you are Lauren. So, um, I would stick to playing, but like, I just know myself, you know, if that's just, and you know, when my, when our son was with us, uh, for a couple of weeks, uh, there was some slippage and creepage, you know, like he was here.

Oh man, of course you're a plain potato chip guy.

Uh, he's now he's in Toronto and he's used, and he wanted to thank you for those contacts that you passed on. Um, uh, Lawrence, I don't know if he's gone to him already, but I said to him, Hey, here's the comp, here's the details from Lawrence. know, they're going to be pre-qualified. It's not just my suggestions. Um, and he goes, yeah, Lawrence gave us all those suggestions in Portugal. They were awesome and great. So he's embarking on that. been there for like a week or so now, uh, just finding his, uh, he, he's way around. Um,

Did he go there? Oh, nice.

But yeah, while he was here, you know, it was like we'd go, it was awesome. We'd come, we'd train together, go and do the steam room, come home. Oh, we'll go past the supermarket. Hey, do you want to get some? Oh, okay. I've got some. And, and look, that just wasn't great. So it's kind of been like bootcamp since he's been gone ah for a week or so. I have, but I just, I, I just know that for myself. So I've got a safeguard and safe, you know, basically create. moats around my behavior because I just know that that's the case. I'm kind of like these little mice in the house. If any, if you've got anywhere in there, I'll sniff it out. I'll find it out. Um, so it's easy just not to have it at all. And I can be a jupyholic, but I can be a whole lot of things, you know? Um, and so I've just had to get that awareness to go, don't make it easy. Don't, don't make it so easy that it's like, I'm bored.

So you're a chipaholic, basically. So when you go to the shopping mall, when you buy groceries, do you avoid the chip aisle altogether?

I try not to like, um, uh, yeah, like, so for me, we have things delivered the majority of the food we have home delivered and it's very easy to impulse by, um, chips if you're doing that, but it's become, you know, the old language of kids is a sometimes food. Um, and so, you know, I really look forward to it. go, Hey, if there's a guilty pleasure, I'll go, yeah, I'll have some crisps, but it's the discipline I've got to create around myself because if, if, um,

Ah, right.

If I go somewhere and there's chips, you know, I'm going to have some of them. That's just the way it is. And, and, and I can be, I can be disciplined, but that only works them to the point. So if, you know, one of the things that you mentioned about traveling is when you're tired, know, fatigue makes cowards of us all. Right. It's very difficult when you're exhausted, jet lagged to push through, to have great workouts. And that I agree with you. It's very destabilizing when you're traveling. And you're not traveling for holiday recreationally. You're you're basically you're going, you're you you've been going there for a particular objective. It's fly, come back and then compress everything else you're doing into that. You know, I had a week like that last week where the week before and this week are really hectic because I went into some contract work down in the UK for a week and it was, it was hectic and something had to give. Right. And I chose to exercise less, but sleep more because that was the variable that I, that I had. And so that's sometimes been the thing that I've had to work out really well is what's the best use. What's the best thing that will help me right now? Is it sleep and rest, or is it another, you know, nine out of 10, 10 out of 10 workout. And while the 10 out of 10 workout may satisfy one part of me, the bigger, more macro view is that it's actually going to deplete me even further. So I've had to make peace.

Yeah. You know, you brought up a very good point, which is like, we talked about discipline as one of the most important things. And I think this is where, like, I think for both of us, the physicality of jiu-jitsu, the physicality of CrossFit or showing up for a class has really kind of instilled like the discipline that you kind of need in all areas of your life. it's like, like, that's why, at least in my opinion, and I think you share the same thing, which is like having a physical routine. is important, not just for your physicality and your health and your fitness, but it actually has a side-on effect on uh what it takes to have the discipline for other parts of your life. And the challenge, think, sometimes is also, too, is not just the discipline, there's also the grind, right? The grinding through the difficulty. And so what I mean, I'm translating this, is like having the discipline to have a scheduled time to work on your business, let's say. like most people don't schedule that time, they're just reacting all the time. And you know, I'm very guilty of this, you're reacting to like things you need to do, the people you need to meet, the thing, you know, so that's not really working on the business for growth, it's just, you're just doing it from a delivery point of view. So we if we don't carve out, and this is what I tell a lot of my clients is that when you don't carve out specific time to work on the business, there is no growth on the business, there's no change in the business, you're just basically just maintaining

Well they can't beat it,

It's just like me showing up to the gym on a regular basis. Yeah, I'm fit for you know, whatever my age or whatever I'm fit, but I'm not actually growing like I'm not actually getting better. I'm not getting stronger. I'm not testing myself in those realms because I'm just maintaining what I got. And so it's the same type of you know things. So you need to have to be able to whirling to fail willing to grind it out willing to kind of do those things. The third thing I would say is ah it's about curiosity, right? I think that if you don't actually have the curiosity um to pursue the work, whatever it is, you're most likely gonna give up. And this is the last part, right? Which is like, there's certain parts I kind of lose um that momentum that I initially had when coming up with the idea. knowing that the amount of work that I actually have to do, I kind of lose that little bit of spark that I actually initially had and realizing like, oh, there's so much work. when I'm curious about something, I'm like, oh, I'll find a way. Like then all of a sudden, you just find those paths to kind of solve those problems. until you, if you don't have that, it just becomes the grind, which is the second part, right? Grind is important, but it can't be all grind because, you know, that could be really, really problematic if you actually don't really figure that out. So that's sort of that, those are the combination I find is necessary. was reading a book.

Yep.

by Bill Gurley called Running Down a Dream. And I've just started it. Bill Gurley is a famous investor in Silicon Valley. I think one of the early investor in Uber when it first got started, I think at the very first, if I'm not mistaken. But anyways, he talks about these. And the first principle he talks about is everybody says follow your passion, but he's actually follow your curiosity. And this is where I'm getting that idea. And I was like, I like that a lot better because really passion is something that people, you It's so trite to kind of say it, realizing like, forgetting what people, and I say this all the time, I say this in my speeches, which is passion, the root word for passion is to suffer, right? Like that's the Latin word, is to suffer. And like the passion of Christ is the suffering of Christ, and not the love of Christ. And so like the passion for following your passion means like following your suffering, like something you're willing to suffer through.

Thank

And that means there's enough curiosity for you to really want to go and search. And I'll tell you one story I just heard from this book, which is about Kobe Bryant. He went and after winning four championships, he actually went and searched out, I think it was Akeem Olajuwon, who was a Hall of Famer and flew to Houston. And he asked him to come and show him this one move that he actually had. And he spent two hours just practicing that one move, that's all they did, just talked about one move, just practice and practice and practice, and he did not stop practicing until he got that move down, because that was the one move that he uh really wanted to master. He didn't even play the same position. think, from memory, Elijah Wong was a center, and Kobe was a guard, but the whole point was he wanted to master his one move, he found the best, who's someone who hasn't even played in a while, he's a Hall of Famer, because he wanted to master one move. And I think that curiosity,

Hmm.

Like it's really um admirable, but it's very also difficult for all of us to kind of recognize like, am I really curious about to pursue to mastery? um And I will say one last thing, sorry, this is like stream of thoughts here. There's that the book of that samurai, I think is uh the book of five rings talks about this, right? It talks about this mastery where like the samurai code is about mastering yourself.

Five rings here.

you get to a point of wanting to master and you still got room to learn about that particular skill set. And it's that concept of curiosity, that concept of wanting to pursue is so important. But what I find challenging is feeling a little bit lost in that, right? It's like, I don't know if you feel this way, it's like you get to a certain age and I'm still curious about a whole bunch of things, but I don't know, maybe it's the time thing, like knowing like there's I don't have a long runway, or at least a feeling of a long runway. So do I want to spend the time to be curious about this? If I was in my 20s, sure, whatever. My daughter's just, you can just see her energy and her passion. She's just so curious about everything because there's no time frame for her, right, yet. Where for me, I feel like, well, if I chose this, I'm giving up a lot of this, right? And so therefore, I don't know. And then it's almost like you kind of get paralyzed. by not doing any of it because you don't want to give up, although, because you want to choose right. And I think that's a very challenging, kind of confronting thought that goes through, at least in my mind.

Yeah, I agree with you with regard to passion and curiosity. I think that's spot on. I actually watched passion of the Christ just probably a couple of weeks ago. I just had this, I hadn't seen it, you know, obviously for a long, long time. And I don't know whether it was, you know, what's been going on in the world and stuff, but I just, I just had the, was just drawn to it, you know, and I happened to see it come up on streaming platform. Yeah, that's the right thing to do. And

Hmm.

over the weekend, it's the same sort of thing where I realized that, you know, like I always look at what is it that draws us to particular genres of movies, right? Either we're looking for inspiration or a story. Horror is a genre I don't get into, but some people need to be terrified with an inch of their life to feel alive. Right. That's not me. Right. I don't, don't, that's not my thing. But I watched, um, passion of the Christ. Because I was curious, was like, Hey, I want to, and I was not inspired by what was available. went, okay, what, what are the feelings that I'm looking for? And so I went back and passionate and I agree with you to watch the suffering as a pro, which is the objective of that. To realize I go, it can't be about that only. It can't be about suffering. know, you can't have a happy ending to an unhappy journey. Right? So find ways to nurture your curiosity, because even when things get difficult, You're inspired and driven and elevated by what it is that gives you joy. So to me, I find that even when there there's challenge, if I, if I'm tapping into that curiosity, that that really helps. But I watched field of dreams, um, uh, over the weekend. And I hadn't seen that for like 20 years and it was so good. It was just a possibility thinking because a lot of the times, you know, there's, there's metrics, there's not, there's this has to equal that and this has to be logical and there's change, you know, and You know, the, narrative at the moment in the world, as far as I can see is everything's going to change. Nothing's going to be as it is. And what, you know, if you do offer a product or service or value to the life and world, what could it possibly be when it will be superseded by technology? I had to go back to those feelings and thoughts of, uh, basically curiosity, but then also possibility. And, and I just, I really connect with those kinds of stories and I use those as an inspiration. I went, what did I take out of that? The possibility that, okay, it may look crazy. You may look silly. You don't have to, doesn't have to be ridiculous, but sometimes you're to come up against all those resistances and obstinacies, obstacles. And sometimes they're your own, but sometimes they're logistical ones. But that to me was really affirming. I think, you know, watching those two movies over the last couple of weeks. has been reaffirming for me to, to, to work on what it is that gives me the guidance and, and, and helps me rather than being reactive. Like you just said, is I'm being proactive. I'm putting my energy to the areas that I want to focus on and, just surrender and let go of the things that aren't.

Interesting. No, I think we do come into seasons ah and each of us have to comes into different seasons. And and what I mean, I'm inspired by sort of what you're kind of going through. And for me, it's like going back to some of the fundamentals that Japan really kind of taught me that I go into Japan and realizing like the culture that actually created the you know, the the way the country runs reminds me of like this didn't happen just by circumstance. It didn't happen just because of like just

Hmm. Mm.

this is how it always has been. like it was created through centuries of like discipline or centuries of like philosophy and principles that are underlying in that culture to bring it what it is. And not saying it's right or wrong, but it just really reminded me to like, for me to kind of go, I got to get back to some of those basics, like the basic foundations and the principles. And I've been actually attracted to kind of go back and listen to some of the uh some key principles of like, know, whoever. it's funny, like what's been popping up on my YouTube is like, you know, sometimes it's like Jim Rohn, you know, like, or, know.

Yeah. Well, that's exactly, that was my whole, that was what I was going to say right now. Right. Is that I went back to the old one, even like just to the left of me, there's a book, there's probably about, I don't know, six 50, my next 50 books to read and none of them inspired me. No, I just went, I just don't want to read any of those. So the, the discipline part, we'll just plow through them. But I just went back through some of the classics, right. And, and that's exactly why. And I've found myself going back to Who had the biggest influence on me at critical points in my time and life and what feeling did that leave me with? So I've gone back and done almost exactly the same thing where I can capture that essence of who I was at that time to tell her transported back to the current point and go, that's who I need right now.

And it's so true, like what you say, like we're in a very precarious, you know, time period. And I know we all hear that often and we all hear it enough times that it's always something is changing. But I do really feel we're in a precipice of some unique change that it's not fast, like it's going fast. Obviously it feels like it's a freaking bullet train, but the impact it will have on the rest of the world won't be felt for. are still a couple of years away. But by the time it actually does happen, you're already kind of either feeling behind or not. And I find that this moment is almost like, it's way faster than what the social media, that aspect. mean, social media came and you're like, oh, like, so new and everything else. But that took a few years before it actually kind of went to the era where we are currently. And so like, I don't think that we understand the impact we'll have. And I'm not really negative about it. I just know that it's just gonna change fundamentally in how we function in this world and what's gonna happen in the environment and where it proceeds. And you can either be a pessimist or can be an optimist. The reality I think is that it's happening whether you like it or not. Like it's gonna go to a direction and it is gonna change the way we live. It's gonna change how... um We're obviously talking about AI here in terms of the impact and how people will work. um And some things won't work and some things will. And what I've spoken to a lot of friends who are deep in the AI and they're all excited. They're like, they're trying to get ahead of the curve. And one of the fascinating things about this, I'm talking to like some of the top guys in tech, top guys in AI, and guess what? None of them have a clear path of what the future holds. Like I don't, I haven't spoken to a single person and going, this is exactly what's going to happen. They all have predictions, of course, but none of them are actually a hundred percent confident or even 90 % or 80 % confident. This is exactly how it's going to turn out. They're just doing, they're just riding this train and trialing different things and hoping that it will, they will just be there on this train fast, long enough that they can adapt and see a path forward.

Hmm.

Um, but no one really knows. And I think that one part people will say that's dangerous because it's like this, you know, bullet train that's going at super speed that no one really knows where it's where it's heading. Um, but also there's also the other people on the train who are thinking like, this is amazing. I'm like doing things that I never thought possible. And I'm already feeling this way. Like there's certain things that, like, that I'm doing that I can't believe I could do like in such a short period of time, which what I would have had to hire. someone to do something which have taken weeks to kind of get back to me. I can do something in less than five minutes and it's already given me a prototype of what I look like. Wow. Like how on earth? like if I can do that, I'm just like a lowly non-tech guy can create this. What are these tech guys doing?

Yep. And that's the curiosity element that you're talking about, right? Because you're asking and the same thing with video, same sort of thing. Lawrence. just recorded a video, which is the part that I go, I can do that. And I just uploaded it into an app and it, and it populated it, created it, edited it, did it ready to go in minutes. And so to me that I, that's what I found as well too. It's like, how do you use this? But the, I was going to say, perhaps the reason why you've been drawing back to Jim Rohn as I have is what we're looking for is these foundational grounding principles that actually help us feel solid internally. Because when there's change of any type externally, I've noticed that myself, I had to, I had to be very selective in terms of what I consume probably more than ever, because I realized I was, I was going down this pathway of really getting concerned about, you know, dark forces and everything that's going on and conspiracies. And that wasn't serving me well because that was the, that was the, the, I don't know, the background filter through which I was looking at everything. And I just went, can't, I can't allow that to enter into my psychology. That's why I don't watch horror films because I don't like that going into my head. And it's the same thing when I suddenly realized, Holy smoke, reality is just as bad as horror at the moment. I'm not going to ignore it, but I'm not going to put my focus on it. And so I had to basically detox because it wasn't serving me very well.

Yeah, it's hard, right? Because sometimes like you, know, especially if you're in the investing world, ah you kind of have to be knowledgeable of this day to day movement. That's what's going on in the Middle East. And, and it does have ramification long term. um You know, that if, it continues, it is, it's going to have this trickle down effect on all sorts of economy worldwide. And you do have to kind of pay attention to it. And, and, but then the other side, which is a flip side of the corn is like, It's just better to be ignorant. Like in the past, you know, when I remember going...

Well, sometimes it's the block yourself off. You're less stressed, but you're more surprised.

Yes, yeah, yeah. I remember the GFC was happening and it like, you know, you can hear it rumbling. It's like, okay, I didn't actually know what was going on during the GFC. I just remember like, okay, well, I know it's bad, but this is the only thing I can control. um But man, it's just, it does have implications. I don't know how you select, like how, what to listen to. you just, because in the past, when I was younger, I just ignored it. I'm like, okay, whatever. It's not my world. This is what I can control. I just focus on it. I feel a little bit differently now because obviously my work and working with people in Tiger and stuff, it does change that context. I do need to be up to date on what's actually happening around the world. How do you kind of filter some of this information and how do you rationalize it in your head?

I, as a, as a rule, avoid current affairs programs. avoid commentary and avoid opinion pieces because, um, because, and so I never watch TV news. actually, if I consume information, I'll either look at it on YouTube, you know, if I something, a specific article I want to find out, I want, I want to get the Snippet. I'll check on platforms like X where it's a short, um, component, but I've got to be careful there because that

Yeah. Hmm, interesting. Yeah.

You know, uh echo chamber is perpetuated there. But the most objective thing for me is I'll get online. I'll read an article in a trusted source. So for me, particularly in the financial area, I'll read financial documentation, which fundamentally deals with the information. And I avoid even the opinion pieces. the financial reviews in Australia and the Wall Street Journal, those kinds of things I'll read because they give me an indication of macro trends specifically to my area. And the other thing is you can do is you just get an RSS feed and those kinds of things where you select the news that's coming to you that influences you directly. So, but I only ever engage online in an article. I'll get the heading and I'll go, no, not interested. I can't, I can't go down that road. I can't go down. I want to know more about this. So I like to have an overview of what's going on, but I get to choose which area and subject matter I sort of deep dive into. That's how I do it.

Yeah, you know the challenging thing in today's age is that who is actually a uh trusted source, right? I think that's worst part because you know, I mean we'll pick America because that's easy to pick on. You know if I'm seeing like, if I see a YouTube video and I look at it as like a CNN, I know what viewpoint they're gonna say. And if I see a Fox, I know exactly what they're gonna say. Even though they're not supposed to be opinionated, they're freaking opinionated. uh And so it's really hard to kind of...

Correct.

and every personality's kind of come into play. I've been toying with this idea, actually, I don't need to set this up. I actually just started playing around with Claude code and stuff. I think what I'm do is I'm gonna actually create some sort of Claude code where I'm just getting feed for like, get them to kind of figure it all out and then just give me like one solid summary in the morning so I just get a briefing, almost like a presidential briefing of like what's going on in the world. So then from both sides of the viewpoint so then I can just be honest and nothing more.

Yeah. Yeah. Great. Well, there's the news, there's newsletters that specifically deal with AI that you can get that only filter in the most important information as it relates to that. So you can get curated newsletters specifically in those areas and the implications. And because I'm involved in finance in Australia, I get as part of my membership, I get curated information as it relates specifically to that. So I consume that and I can stay within that lane. And yeah, there's, other specific areas that I just look at and say, keep it consistent to what I need to work out. But I just can't afford to open my mind up to anything that's all out there without some level of calibration and filtering, because otherwise it'll just relieve me down paths that just don't serve. And I also am curious and mindful of when I consume that. So You know, I'll get my stuff done first. was a lot like I'm saying with you, like I'm going to go, because of my work schedule, sometimes I've got to train later in the evenings. That doesn't work for me really well. It's, it's never the same session. My best session of the week is Saturday morning at 12 30 because that's the ideal time, but because of my schedule at the moment, I can't always do that. And so sometimes it's got to be later in the day, which is the compromise. Um, but we've got daylight savings coming up. Um, in, in a country. that's going to change a little bit. And it's going to make some of that schedule different. Um, but this period was being brutal, uh, for you. I'm not sure if you found the same thing as well. Time zones. This period has been a bit more brutal.

Workouts are definitely one of those challenging things that I don't do well if it's any time other than I'm so disciplined with my like early morning 550 class, you know that if I don't do it at a time, I'm just not going to do it. And so the biggest thing for me that has been I don't know I for me I'm just like I work. I know I work my appointments outside of those so that have enough. I think I just I just can't accept it because if I screw up but the problem with working out first thing in the morning. I'm not utilizing that time to be the most productive on my other work, right? And so I get challenged by that because by the time I come home, shower, get ready, da da, send the kids off, I'm like, okay, now then I got calls, like Australia calls and da da but by time I actually finish, it's noon. And then I'm now, this is why you ask the question because like, why is it that you don't get the focus time? It's because it's about one o'clock in the afternoon by the time I actually hit the important work. And I'm like, I'm done.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm gonna just, I'm gonna go walk the dog with my wife.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I totally get that. so let's start winding that down, Lawrence, in terms of what we're covering today. So I think you've raised some really good points about the essence of what it is that makes doing life easier or harder. What we specifically may do that derails us and we both have covered things that we've identified that, okay, left to its own devices. This is where I generally go. So it's important about building structures and systems and processes around that. And, you know, what's really interesting is some of the most disciplined people that you, you know, some of the most successful people that you know, have amazingly rigid systems that other people impose around them because they can't do it just by themselves. You know, for every Jocko Willick, who's a really super disciplined person, you've got a hundred other people who need support and that's where they bring fence their, their results with people, situations, processes that allow them to get rid of the distractions and build systems. I've had to do that because yeah, I could, I could basically, you know, life like everybody else. And I agree with you. I much prefer to train first thing in the morning, but if I can't, it gets, it's like a tick, a bomb that's ticking. That's just getting harder and harder as the day goes on. If I don't get it done early. Yeah.

Yeah, for sure. because you gotta fight it. Yeah, I think one of the things that we haven't talked about today that I'll sort of finish up on, which is we talked about how important it is to be disciplined and scheduling and carving out that time or protecting that time. But usually what I find is that you do that well when everything is going right. And so what we don't do is actually create a plan when things don't go right or when you're traveling or like for me, like I know my next three months are, it's gonna be. somewhat of a nightmare, which I haven't told you about yet. Obviously, like you because it's going to affect our recording. But it's like, how do you plan for like planning for those moments? You know, because the regularity, the perfect day or the perfect week, like that's easy, right? To carve that. But when things are not going right, when you're sick or what happens when you're traveling and what are you doing? That's what I don't have usually planned for. It's like um when I don't actually have my gym class and stuff like.

Yeah, yeah.

What am I disciplining? Am I still waking up in the morning and just doing whatever? Or just usually what happens is like, oh, I should probably work out. And then you spend like 15 minutes just trying to find a workout. And then you're like, ah then you don't do anything. Versus just going, here's the workout when I'm traveling. And this is what I'm going to do. And so it's already kind of done. So that's planning for the unexpected is something that I don't think many of us do very well.

Hmm. Yeah. Yeah, that was good. That'd be good. And you know what, if it helps you any, anyway, shape or form Lawrence, that podcast is called the art of imperfection. So I can adapt to that. It's not called the art of every week, every Tuesday at 1pm, we have a podcast recording um rain, hail or shine. So I'll be adaptable. I'll be flexible. We can make it work. And yeah, thank you for today. Really good. I've got a lot, lot out of that.

Like we always do. All right, hope that you guys have been enjoying that and hope that you guys can extract some of our sort of painful lessons and also difficulties and hopefully apply to your life to make your life better. And that's the goal of this particular podcast. We'll see you until the next episode. Take care.