The AI Paradox

Welcome to Wabi Sabi, the art of imperfection. I am excited for today because it's been a while. It's been, we've missed a couple of recordings. Yeah, absolutely. But it hasn't been three weeks since we actually seen each other, which was great. On our last podcast, we talked a lot about we were just about to catch up for the very first time. And I actually think it's been over a year, hasn't it? At least since last time we kind of seen each other in person. It was great to catch up with you. And it was just kind of great to hang out with you for a couple of days.

Nearly three weeks, nearly three weeks since we recorded last Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. It was caught up in Birmingham and caught up with our closest, nearly 600 friends at a conference there. was, it was really good. how, how electric was, we've been saying this for a while. I was having with that live events and being in a room with people is going to be great. It stimulates conversations. gets you thinking, you and I had a little meeting as well where we went, okay, what's the next steps that we would like to go into? So we ducked off and had a conversation. And I think that has opened up different files in both our brains as well. So, but there's nothing that replaces a live event.

Yeah, I think there's this energy around, uh you know, meeting people in person. think we as humans are still wired to kind of, you know, have, uh you know, one-on-one conversations in person. I feel like, you know, the COVID era during that time period where we couldn't see each other, like, I think only it like puts this one-on-one uh meetings live in person to make even more relevant, I think, to today. Like, you know, I really miss the events that I used to put out a lot, as much as I don't mind not traveling as much anymore. But I do miss the connection that you get to meet with people and just there's something about that, right? About human, I mean, sure, technology is amazing that we can actually, you know, we're in two different countries and different parts of the world and we can still have a connection and still record and see each other.

Yep.

But there's just something special when you're actually meeting a person because I think you get to physically trust someone, but there's also this energy that you can actually see and there's I think a lot of hidden communication that is just not there through a screen.

Yeah, totally. And you had to do like a plane strains and automobiles to get there too. From memory that and on the way back. It's like I'm flying in here. I've got to leave here. I've got the train here. I can't get a direct flight. So was a little bit of a, yeah, it was an effort just for you to get there, right?

I know it's crazy, know, like Birmingham, know like it's not like the most priming spot or thing, nothing offense to anybody who lives in Birmingham, but.

I'll be honest, it's my least favorite airport to just fly in and out of. I just don't like it at all.

I flew there two, seven days apart. Like I had to do that twice. I did that with my family. You know, as I, you know, I to get up at like, I don't know, it 3 a.m. I had to get up and then I had to get there early. was there only in the UK for 36 hours. But yeah, going back was actually strange. I had to go and take the train to Manchester to fly out of Manchester because there was no direct flights from Birmingham back to Lisbon, which was surprisingly. And going to the train, actually a train was. way busier than I thought I thought was gonna be having a nice seat actually had a seat like I booked a seat I couldn't even get to my seat because there was so busy with people on the train I'm like all right I'm just gonna wait until some of these people get off and yeah it was actually yeah it was definitely plane trains and automobiles um for me to kind of get there but now that I know definitely do not take the taxi from from Birmingham to the uh to the hotel I don't know I didn't tell you this Jim but

Yep. Yeah, yeah, yep.

You know how we said, you know, to take that taxi ride was five minutes, I think, and it cost me like 20 pounds, right? I didn't.

Yeah, yeah, it's it's it's it's a rort that one.

Right, exactly. But here's the thing that the week after, just so you know, we actually, I took the train. I dropped the car off back to Birmingham because we're going to take the train to London, but there's a monorail that goes right to the NEC. And then I just walked from, we're going to just walk from the NEC to the hotel, which has only been a five minute walk anyways. But anyways, that's something that we kind of, well, missed out on. Yeah.

Alright. gonna do that next time. I'll do that next time. Next time I'll focus on it, but we spent a bit of time and like having a chat and a conversation. And I guess from us, you know, the feedback that we've gotten for people, I'd love you to just expand on that if you, if you want to, like people enjoying the podcast, but we'd know in ourselves, there's a next level. Like where is that going to go? You know, how are we going to adapt and grow? like we have, there's an, there's an uncertainty of life and that's been a really important theme. And I'm just getting the calling and as I have from other people, certainly from you that, okay, we're going to not that we're going to shift, but we're going to start incorporating a different theme or a topic in there. You know, that's how that's the feedback you've been getting as well too.

Yeah, so I think the reality is once we start, you know, being able to finally talk to people who are listening to a podcast, because the thing that with podcasts, you know, versus like a live audience and live audience, and we are on stage, you're talking to you know, you're doing a speech, you can kind of tell if people are like vibing with you or not, like, are they really understanding? Or are they jelling with the message you're actually trying to provide? Right now, like the only person I get a feedback from is you, Jim, and you're most one of the most agreeable people in the world. And so we're just kind of like, constantly just sort of feedback. And so we're

Yep. Hehehehehe

We're this little uh echo chamber of just me and you loving each other's ideas, but we actually don't get any, lot of feedback from, you know, from a live audience. So, and that's a challenge of podcasts because you're just putting stuff out there and you just hope that someone else, you know, is enjoying it and actually getting some great impact from it. And luckily we were, you know, had a couple of people actually who would come up to us and go, Hey, we love your podcasts and loved kind of hearing you guys talk about and banter about, you know, various topics and.

Yeah.

What this kind of gives us an idea of I mean, this is an ask actually, I know it's kind of the beginning of this particular episode. But I think an ask for you guys is that if you're a listener, if you've been listening to us for quite some time, will be really helpful is send us a personal message, you know, whether it be on, you know, an email or on Facebook or whatever channels you can have access to us and write us a message and let us know like, what topics do you want us to explore? You know, not to say that we're experts in those things, but like what can we talk about if you know if you've been listening a long time listener what you notice is that we just talk about things that we kind of enjoy or what we think about what be relevant to our audience and so we'd love to kind of hear about it and if we don't know something we'll let you know too and this is how we think about a particular topic that you know may not be relevant.

Yeah. So it's under construction in a lot of ways, shape and form. And that was, that's what the thing was. So you're right. mean, I have, you know, I had private messages along the way, but I like it when it's in a, in a concentrated format where you're talking to people and they can directly say, Hey, this, this helped me, or this is what I did. And, know, a couple of people who came up to us, quite a few actually, who said, okay, this is how it's helping me. I appreciate the transparency that you're going through. So that, that, that Kind of validates the point. I said to you, I just love getting on here and having to chat to you once a week. And, we do it that way. And we see that that goes and uh the project was always about the journey initially, but that's kind of evolved unless either of us are planning on moving in the next little while. Um, then it'll, it'll take its own shape and form. And that would be probably a little bit, uh, more structure, but some, okay. What's what else?

Mm-hmm.

is there is pretty much the thing. And I think that's just the natural order and curiosity that follows when you've been doing something for a while and you just go, okay, this is really cool. How do I want to develop this?

Hmm. Yeah, so I think, um you know, what might be helpful for this particular episode is like the emotional roller coaster that I know we go through in the span of like the last two weeks, and some of the highs and the lows like for me, you know, coming out of, uh you know, Birmingham was was great, because I mean, got me energized about um just meeting people again, the live events, I got excited about meeting you and uh I'm not meeting you, but seeing you again, and just hanging out and just having great discussions. And the ideas that were kind of flowing from that. conversation and hopefully now we can actually put it together and I'm excited about where the potential of this podcast is going to go and I'm also excited about the potential things that we can add to it that allows um the evolution of where this podcast and the content and the audience is going to evolve in the community that we get to build.

Yep. And you know, a lot of us, kudos to you for like, cause for a long time, you've been championing the AI theme and you've been talking about it. And I remember saying to you ages ago that even back in Australia, when we were coaching, the thing that I always recognize, we had different coaching organizations even back then, but you were always pioneering in terms of seeing trends. probably a lot earlier than all I was did. And you were talking about them and sometimes people would go, okay, I can't see the connection. And yet now what's happening, the lag has gotten a lot closer to now, even, you know, like everywhere you look, everybody's got a summit on AI. Everybody's talking about it. And sometimes when you have a concept, an idea, and I know you've run seminars about it and that you ran them in Germany and it was great and it had concepts and content. So. Sometimes when you are one of the first person, people who brings out a concept, people quite often go, how is this relevant to me? They can't see it. And it's, and it's, there's something about being able to hold a vision or a message until the rest of the people catch up. And I think that that's what's been going on because even today I had a couple of coaching calls from people who long, long-term clients who are in industries outside of healthcare. who actually said, right, awesome. Let's have five of us today. And they go, I want to talk about AI and how it's going to affect my industry. And I'm like, Whoa, okay. We talk about this regularly, but these are like in services businesses in, in, um, you know, basically rank and file long established profitable, successful business who have now gone, Hey, there's this thing that I was aware of, but now the, the, the whisper has suddenly gotten a lot louder and it's really interesting. So.

Hmm.

Talk to me about the process of having an idea. Like where does the idea concept come from and how do you follow that uh as a theme and a trend to change direction on what you may have done before?

Yeah, so I'm currently in that stage right now. Like I literally had a conversation with my developer right now. We're trying to develop something that's going to help the healthcare uh practices around the world uh regards to utilizing AI. And the problem is that oftentimes is that I'll use this as uh a story, as a backdrop and an analogy, right? So just in the last two weeks since I spoken to you, I don't think I've actually announced this to you, but my daughter got into St. Andrews. uh Yes.

Oh really? Well that's great. No didn't know. Yeah you told me about... That is awesome.

Yeah. So she applied to St. Andrews and nine days later she, she got accepted and that was awesome. Like, and she was the first one in her school to get a, uh, an acceptance that, and you know, she'll be, she hasn't fully accepted yet because it's still conditional obviously, but you know, she most likely will end up going there. Um, who knows? We'll, talk maybe in six months time and then we'll kind of verify that. But for her to just get in, um, it's great, you know,

Hmm.

I'm proud of her. She deserves, you know, all the praise. uh people come and say, you know, congratulations to me. I'm like, I didn't do a thing. I didn't do anything, but it's all on her. Right. And so, but here's the thing about that, right? This uses an analogy of what we talked about. um Accepting the entrance to a university, like for her, we see Andrews, is just the first step, right? So for example, a company embracing AI is the first step. The hard work actually begins once you accept it to then apply the next four years to apply that to get a degree out of it. And I think that's the same thing with AI. The problem that most people weren't doing in the last few years is they can kind of see AI being a big thing, but they haven't accepted that this is gonna change our industry. And I think now what you're saying is that we're falling again into this position of where they're finally accepting that maybe we need to pay attention to this more because we've gone past

Hmm.

the AI slop that's out there in a sense of, and this is what's gonna get most in the media, right? The most in the media is like, oh my God, look at Sora, look at all these video tools and how amazing they can be. And then we start playing with it, right? How many people during, I don't know, maybe three, four months ago was making like all cartoon or toy figures of themselves, right? Everything starts there because everybody just does the basic kind of thing. Oh, this is kind of cool, but it's a fad, it goes away and it's gone. But that's not what AI is about, right? That's not gonna transform your business, right? By you making a character of yourself. Like that's not gonna change anything. It's fun, but it's not going to shift anything. What oftentimes get missed is all the things behind, right? People are focusing on the wrong things. And the wrong things is that the thing that's behind the scene, that that's what's gonna kill practice, right? That's what can literally destroy um practices if they don't keep up, if they don't understand what's going on. And to me, I always say, you know, I actually did a video that...

Yep.

you know, got a little bit of pushback from people, which was that um I just said, you know, solo practices are dead. You know, if you're working and people thought I meant, you know, without actually going through the whole video, like they honestly felt that I was saying like, no, you know, if you're practicing on your own, you're done. No, I didn't say that. I just said thinking like with a solo practice mindset, thinking that you have to do everything yourself, that part is dead. Exactly, exactly. Yeah, like you can't.

Mmm. Like a silo, like a silo being, yeah, I'm by myself. Yeah. Yeah. Got it.

You can't do everything, it's almost impossible because there's too many roles that you have to play now in today's business world. And we're talking, I'm not talking like multi-million dollar, but I'm just talking a solo practice, right? And you not only have to be a great technician, like when you and I were in practice gym, like way back when we first started, as long as you're a great chiropractor, right? As long as you had some communication skills to describe and be able to communicate with people, you're good, right? You're most likely gonna be successful 80 % of the time.

Yep. Yeah.

But nowadays you actually have to be a great leader, a CEO, to be able to lead teams, hire teams, recruit teams, and also train them. You also have to be a great social media manager to actually know how to create content, right? And you know, if you're a YouTuber versus a LinkedIn versus a Facebook versus Instagram versus TikTok, each one of those platforms require a different skill set, right?

Yeah.

and a podcast and all this stuff. Like now all of a sudden I only have to be a great practitioner. I have to be a social media expert and ads expert and you have to be a leader and you have to be a high. Like you just way too many hats for you to do. You got retention problems, you got conversion problems. So now if you think like that, because there's no way you could be super expert in all of these areas. It's impossible. None of us can do that. So now what I want, the reason why I'm saying this is that you have to learn to adapt. You have to learn to adapt and go. I don't need to do that. Either you either hire a whole bunch of people doing all of these things, or with the technology, emerging technology of AI is that you can actually do a lot of these things without actually hiring all of these different members. You can actually just hire, uh just imagine a team of AI agents, right? A team of an AI, um not bots, but like AI team members on your team, which I almost call like the Avenger team, to actually do all of these things. to allow you the freedom to be more human in your practice. See, most people think of AI and they're like, oh, I'm gonna automate, I don't like that, you know, it just takes away. No, no, you're thinking about this wrong. I'm talking about the task that you don't even wanna do, your CAs don't even wanna do. We're talking about tasks that allows you to be the person so that you can actually have that human connection we've been talking about that all of us are striving for to allow the robots to do what they need to do, these AI agents and all these other AI tools to help you be more efficient. and have more time and freedom and more profitability because you're not paying 10 different people doing all these random things.

Yeah, was Sam Altman just, you know, he's gone on record and say from open AI saying that the time will come where you'll have the first one person billion dollar company coming. And, and, and you can see that happening. And even, even, you know, when I was talking to a guy today who runs a pool company, right? Like building pools and, uh, uh, basically the, the blowers in the, in the spas, uh, in the pool, they're basically talking about, and we're talking about Sora. sort of two that came out today. that was, that was imagined. So this is a person who's come along and gone, he's probably older than me. He's gone, look, I'm aware of this. And we talked about it and we said, well, look, what are the, what are the features that we always talk about? What is it that engages people? Cause people buy emotionally and justify logically. So you now have an opportunity to create a panoramic cinema, cinematic view and picture of your services, building characters, enjoying your, um, your products and services and you've suddenly, and you would have had to have a production team. They're, uh, costing you tens of thousands of dollars for a day, just to basically come up with that clip that you can actually prompt and have ready in 15 minutes, which is just insane, you know, from that perspective. So I think, you know, we always traditionally talk about barriers to entry in, terms of an industry. So a lot of the times. What was considered traditionally as a, as a motor around your business was to make sure that there was safety. And a lot of the times it's either proprietary knowledge or, it's finance capital, the cost to invest in industries to sorry, in, services to be able to do that, which stopped other companies just being able to open up next door. But what happens now is that the barriers are the cost entry. The most things have decreased so much. And even the skillset for a lot of people has decreased where suddenly what was an competitive advantage is no longer competitive advantage. And you have to adapt and you have to incorporate to say, look, I've run a long-term accounting practice, for example, for many, many years now, law firm. now, uh, basically I now can have a lot of that done externally. I don't need a whole lot of people. This suddenly half three quarters of the office gone.

Yeah, and that's the thing about, you think about all these companies right now, like the biggest talk is, uh companies are laying off a whole bunch of people. That may or may not be true, but the reality that it's most likely gonna happen, it's just that, these workers are not gonna necessarily be displaced. I just think that those workers, if I were one of those workers now, you gotta ask yourself is, what skills do I need to upgrade to wards that actually have another chance to move

Hmm.

towards another job, right? And if they don't do that, if they don't actually, they're just expecting another job is gonna come up, you doing exactly the same thing, that's when they're gonna be at a loss. And so I think there's gonna be more opportunities available, but you have to be willing to re-up skill yourself to be able to um be employable. And I think that the challenge right now is that most people are, you know, let's say a health practitioner, because that's who we kind of spend a lot of time with. or even any business owner is that we tend to sit on our laurels to do this exact same thing that we've always done. Because most of us, especially like us who has been in practice for over 20 years, we go like, I don't want to have to go back and learn. Like that's the attitude a lot of our colleagues would have. And because like I've already done my hard work, I don't need to, I don't want to go back. And that attitude, that mindset is going to be the detriment to them. It's because, and I'm not saying,

That's the codec of philosophy, right?

Yes, exactly. The blockbusters, the Kodak, right? It's just a thinking like you have a monopoly and you think that you're so big that you're not going to die or you're not gonna fail. But that's attitude is, you're gonna get swallowed up, right? And the challenge is that you don't know what's coming around the corner. And there's no way you're gonna be an expert in anything just by using it the first time just because you're an expert in another field.

Yep. Yep.

You know, I'm learning these things as I go along, but I'm already changed. Even the last 12 months, the habits have already changed in how I think and how I behave in just normal day-to-day life. And this is the creep. It's such a small little creep, but these small little creeps will lead to human changes in how we behave. So for example, if we go back to the 2000s, right? Right? actually, let's go to two sections in the 1990s, right? There were very minimal amount of people that had mobile phones. When I was in school, and in a chiropractic college, I had a pager. So for those of you who don't understand a pager was like a patient would call call me when I was in student clinic would call my number and would leave a message on the voicemail of the pager, I would get a beep in my little belt. and saying that I have a message, which then I had to go to a phone to call my message bank to find out what the message was about, whether that person decided to cancel or whatever, right? So that was high technology back in the late 90s, right? And when I first got to Australia in 2002, I remember everybody had mobile phones and I was like, wow, I'm the only person. My first mobile phone I ever bought was in Australia. It was in Sydney, right? That was the first mobile phone I ever got was in 2002. Maybe I was a little bit behind, but that was when I first bought my mobile phone. But as more and more people start using mobile phones and texting each other, guess what happens, right? More and more people are gonna adapt to that, right? No different than the first fax machine. Who are you gonna fax to, right? Exactly, right? then, so, if you think about mobile phones in Australia, at least, was very different the way it was done, because all mobile phones starts with a zero four. So which means no matter if you were on one side of the country in Perth, to Sydney, it was a one fixed rate, right? Versus like,

Yeah, that's right. That's an eternal optimist. That first person.

a long distance call if you have to do it the other way. So, and everybody creeped into mobile phones. Remember the 2000s, there was no social media, right? You know, it was just emails and back and forth. And then all of a sudden in 2007, when Facebook came around, it was like, oh, that's just kind of interesting. But over time, give it five years or whatever, everybody's on social media. And that changed the way, look at how social media has changed how we behave, right? Look at what mobile phones have done. How many people do you ever see go on a train or plane or just even, I was in London last week. The amount of security guards that are in stores in each front of every store is kind of scary because that you know what's that signaling is like, you know, there's just tons of like crime that's going on. None of that's that's a totally different topic. But what is the security guards actually doing? Back in the day when we were young, security guards were actually security guards. They were actually watching you what they're doing. You know what security guards are doing right now? They're basically doing this.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

They're looking at their phones, right? They're watching videos. They're not because they, that's social media. It's changing how we behave. And I feel like this thing, AI, it's exactly the same thing. I don't know how it's changed you, but it's changed the way I research. When's the last time you went to Google and actually typed in something versus going to ChatGPD and asked a question?

Uh, I, I, I, I, I, I usually go now to chat and grok and I'll check those components out. And, and I know funny enough, I have really appreciated the, the voice prompts. Like that's what I love about prom crock is like, I don't want to, I just talk, I go, I feel like I'm having a conversation. I'll just go, cause I, you know, I go for a walk and I have all these random thoughts all the time. And I go, I must remember this. I must remember this. must remember this. And I, and, and.

Hmm. Yes. So fast.

like, but this, my, the lag between thought and answer is a nanosecond now. I don't know whether it taps into an ADD issue or component or whatever. I don't care, but I just, looked at that and I just went, I love that feature where I'm, I've got a question, Hey Grock, know, tell me this and blah, blah. So, Hey, this is what you're thinking about blah, blah, What about this? That, is phenomenal. I love it as a tool. And interestingly, I look at all these applications where I quote, I find myself going, How else will this be useful? And finally enough, I look at applications and go, if you're lonely.

Mm-hmm.

If you're lonely, if you're an old person in a retirement home, suddenly you feel like you have conversation. Now granted it's artificial, but how different is it to someone on the other end of a phone who you're having a conversation with? Like to me, there's, there's all these applications. I know it probably is going extreme, but then that's how you, you. Yeah.

I don't think that's extreme at all. think that's the reality is that people make fun of it they do take the outliers. The outliers, you hear in the news, like, someone decided to marry their AI. Okay, freaking sure. That's the ridiculousness of that thing, but that's extreme of everything. But let's think about the complication of, I think that that's perfect example where an uh elderly person, or if you're feeling lonely or you want to have a chat too, sometimes you can't want to talk to an adult.

Yeah. Marry them. Yep. Yep.

Maybe it's like my kid who doesn't wanna talk to, know, about something serious. They can have an ability for an AI to kind of give them some relevant information. Now, hopefully, right, that information is helpful, it does, it, AI has changed our uh ability to, um of course it has a disadvantage, but I'm talking about the advantages. I'll give you one clear example which has helped me basically, uh helped me, uh Recruit five figures at least. Definitely over five figures, right? Mid-five figures. So I'll give you an example. I was part of the, there was a company called FTX about three years ago. ah yes, yes, Sam, I can't remember his last name. Basically, Sam, yeah, Ben Fried. So he created FTX and it was a whole crypto thing. It was such a big thing and basically it collapsed, right? I got caught up in that.

Yep. Same. SBF. Bank free. Bank retreat.

and I had some of my stocks and some crypto in it and some cash. And when went bankrupt, it was shut down, you couldn't sell anything. And so I got caught up and I thought, well, I'm never gonna see that money again. And I should have been smarter to take the money, to take the stuff out. But anyways, I got through the bankruptcy in the last three years, through the filing, I got some of it back, the stocks. you know, in cash value of what it was sold for back in three years ago, which obviously lost all the gains, but whatever, I got some back, right? But there was still, I don't know, let's just call it like $30,000, I was still outstanding, that was in whatever. I didn't think I was ever gonna get that back. And I didn't even know where to search. And I just left it, I left it, and one day I just thought, you know what, I don't know how to read any of these filings or anything, I have no idea why this is. So I just went to chat and just go, Regardless of this FTX Euro thing, I have this. How do I get access to this? And seriously, within a couple of prompts, they told me to go to this website. I clicked on it, entered in my details. Swear to God, within a week, I got my money back. It was just sitting there. I just didn't know how to follow the process. It's so complicated.

Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's phenomenal. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, man. That's, that's phenomenal. But you know what? What's really interesting is that I read that must've been three months ago that that had gone through and pretty much all the money had been retrieved. So I didn't know that you're in there. Otherwise I would have gone, Hey, Lawrence, there's, there's something there. Right? So you don't know. Like I, I, I,

Yes. Yeah.

have an interest in that kind of thing, right? So I would have been aware of it, but you don't know and you don't know what you don't know.

Well, I knew that went through, because I did get emails about it, but it never showed up. Like it never showed up in my account, right? But it wasn't very clear on, released some of it, it didn't release all of it. It only released part of it. And I'm like, what happened to this part? But there was almost like no one to contact, right? And I was just like, oh, do I chalk it up? But it was just a simple prompt. And here's an example of like,

Oh, okay. Okay. Got you.

There's, you know how many hours I would have to gone through to go through Google, to go to the relevant websites and Reddit and post and try to figure all of this out? It literally did that within, I would say probably five minutes of just having a couple of prompt conversations and maybe click to find out. And that's the power it can have. In my life, it's already changed how I think and, you know, and process different things.

Yeah. And I'm reminded of this old story of, the farmer who had, you know, a horse or horse, sorry, it must've been a uh horse that ran away and the parable goes, oh, that's bad luck. And the farmer's going, maybe yes, maybe no. And then the army comes in and, know, you've got this son who's broke his leg. So the way that I look at this is people go, Hey, like it's just in this last week, Lawrence, you know, like, I even, think I shared it to you that.

Yeah.

Uh, um, the, human, um, robot that's been released, like $20,000. Now I said to you, I don't normally buy the first version of anything. let it work out all the kinks, but I look at that and go, I would be interested in that, you know, um, down the track, you know, it may be a bit freaky. You might got to make sure you don't run into each other. But if I didn't have to do a whole lot of things that take bandwidth that have to get done then. But then I suddenly went, well, what's going to happen to all the cleaners?

Oh yeah.

What's going to happen to all, you know, like all those. you start thinking that, but I always now think of it as maybe it's good. Maybe it's bad. don't know yet. Time will show that out, but how can I use this in a, productive way? That's, that's what I've realized my thinking has gone to.

And I think that the thing is that you still have time if you choose to kind of dive into it, right? So the Neo, I think it's Neo, I think that's the robot, the humanoid robot that you sent me. But if you actually saw the actual video, did you actually watch the video where they did, I don't know who interviewed them. Like all of those movements were actually done by someone with a VR goggle, doing it behind the scenes, right? And a lot of those things took a long time. which means to tell, I'm gonna put a bet right now, I'm gonna call it.

Yep, Neo, yep. Yep. Yep. Yep, yep, yep.

that that's not that particular company most likely is not going to be successful. And the reason why I'm saying that

Yep. Because sometimes the first people, the first people to our technology aren't always the ones that monetize it. Right? Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, I think they released it way too early. You know, I do agree with, know, I think I sent you a video about the review because I think they released it way too early. Sure, the concept is amazing, like visually, you can see it, but I don't know if they're gonna be able to catch up to, you know, to where they want it to kind of be. Now, I will put higher bets on Elon's Tesla bots, right?

Oh, totally. Yep.

they demonstrating, but they're not releasing it. You see, that's the key part. Like it's like, here's what he can do. And I believe in that. the robots are coming. I think, I don't know, I'll make a prediction that robots will be here probably in two years, right? I think in two years time, I think we're going to see the first robots going to be released. Now, is it going to be perfect? Hell no. Is it going to do some basic tasks? Yes, probably. But most people are just, but that's what, that's the separator. Here's the mindset you kind of asked for, right? The mindset of most people is like, yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

They're just gonna poo poo it, right? Yeah, but what is that leading up to as a foundation to where it's gonna go? Right, that's what we gotta start thinking about, right? Because it was like, oh yeah, the robot's a failure. No, I think it will lead to something else, which is a lot of the manual labor is gonna be taken out, right? uh Some of the things which frees you up more time, which what's the knock-on effect?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep.

I think that's what we need to kind of see. a business is the smart businesses are looking at is like, what's the knock on effect? You're not gonna be uh eliminated tomorrow, nor in the next six months, right? Some of them will be, but not all. But you do need to see and keep an eye on technology and go, how does this impact me in one year, three years, five years, 10 years? Especially if you're in your 20s, man, you should definitely be thinking.

Yeah.

how this is gonna impact the career or whatever business you're planning to build.

Yeah. Yeah, I agree. I agree. It's, it's, I think I always quite often say, look, it's, it's a well and good, you know, it's important to feel like you're in the right place at the right time, but then know it. And I really feel like we're in a generational shift. That's just, I haven't got all the answers worked out. I don't have a lot of them worked out to be honest, but I know that something's coming. I want to get onto it. And I think A while ago, this is what I, I, I love the idea that I heard a story recently where, know, I mentioned about Bitcoin to you. So I'm coming to it from, from the lens of a traditional financing component and there's a lot of volatility. Heck, there's a lot in the last week or two, but what's happening is that you've got people who were early adopters who are just getting out and leaving. But you've got institutions that are coming in. it's natural that people, there's a shift. People have gone, Hey, I'm taking my billion dollars off the table. moving on. other people, institutions are coming in and going great. So they're going to put a floor underneath it. So that's, that's what you end up saying. But I love the explanation of Bitcoin that said Bitcoin is everything you don't know about finance married with everything you don't know about technology. And that creates massive uncertainty. Right. And I went, what a brilliant Venn diagram to visualize, but you've got that. Right. As, a, as a, as a trend that's occurring, but I read, um, if you're, have you come across Jeff boost book in search of tomorrow? Yeah. So that like, I've gone down the rabbit hole big time in the last six or eight weeks, big time, like everything you could imagine about AI, like, because that's, that's how I do things. Right. I, get just like, go depth and I want to, I get obsessed, right. To the point where I was smashing out two or three books a week on this and.

Yeah. I noticed. Yeah, Obsessed.

But that to me, that that's curiosity. And so they talk about, you know, um, not that talk about, we've talked about universal base income before, but he's talking about deflation and with technology, the cost of things get cheaper. effectively, and I'm not sure if you listen, I listened to Joe Rogan's podcast with Elon just the other day. And that was, that was a really good one. That's probably, I think you'll really like this one. So I won't spoil it, but they're talking about.

That's on my list.

that, but in a different concept, what about not a basic level, but at a higher level, right? So if we've got productivity gains, if we've got efficiency gains, the cost of services and a lot of tasks ends up in being zero. If you think about it, just a little bit of energy. So consequently people will have more time. So it really stimulates my mind to go, well, where, how's this going to apply? How's this going to work? And it's no point just hitting the sand or, um, going, Oh, hopefully it'll come past me. I've always.

Hmm.

Adopted that view that that's dangerous when you just I don't want to see it. I want to look at it It's dangerous. So I'm that's why I've gone head head into it, know, really really deep and just go on into know I want to know as much about as I possibly can

Yeah, so let's talk about from the listener's point of view here. You know, if they're listening to this and go, yeah, I hear you, but I don't know where to start. Because the thing is, is that there's so many components to this and there is a lot to learn. So what would your recommendation be to how, how would you someone approach this? You know, if they already bought into this, they go, they agree like Jim Lawrence, we hear you, you're gonna have, we definitely need to kind of do something about this. I need you to, but where do I start? Where do I begin? What would your, what would your recommendation be?

that's a great question and I think that nothing makes you take notice by putting some money into something. All right, so if you want to find out about the stock market, you can hypothetically just analyze it and whatever and spend three years working out paper trading and never actually take action. To me, how I started uh most areas, whether it was investing in shares or whether it in

Hmm.

Bitcoin was I worked out, okay, I was going to put a small amount of money in there just to have an awareness. And suddenly you've got some money in there. start taking an interest in things. And so to me, I think you have to have some level of engagement in there so that you're engaged in the process. And then from then start reading, start, go back to the absolute basics, never worried about, Hey, I'm just starting this from, from the start. Can go to sources that are like one-on-one, you know, Um, AI for dummies or Bitcoin for dumb or investing for dummies and just go back and start understanding principles to me is, the starting point is, and then the moment from there, that will guide your curiosity because every book that I've, I've gone down an article and it started from this and that led me to that. Then led me to that. That led me to that. So suddenly I remember uh hearing someone say the moment you start, if you've invested a hundred hours in a particular subject, You've, you surpassed like 99 % of people in that area within a hundred hours. And so suddenly, you know more about something. So it could be about botany. It could be about, I don't know, dog houses, whatever it is, you know, but you become more focused on it because you've got something, but when you've got skin in the deal, it just ramps the stakes up so much more. I it doesn't have to be a lot of money.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so that's perfect. That's yeah, that's a perfect analogy. And I think that that you do have for me is definitely you have to get your hands dirty, right? In a sense, that's part of the term for it. You do have to be experienced experiential for most people to kind of really get the true understanding. I didn't invest for a very long time and, and it wasn't until I bought my first whatever where you feel like, you know, when I remember going through that first, maybe I would say first six months to a year of investing and into some stocks and whatever, and Bitcoin or whatever I was investing in. I realized that it wasn't about the money. Cause I mean, you know, when you're investing a little bit of money, your gains are like, sure. Someone would go up 10 % like, Ooh, but a hundred dollars gains like $10. Right? So it's like, that's not the point. But what I realized I was, what I was learning is I was learning how to deal with the emotions of the ups and downs. You know, I was dealing with like when something drops 20 % or when something, the elation that

Yeah.

when something goes up by 30 % and how was I managing my emotions and just watching it. And when you're in the game long enough, you start to realize like these ups and downs occur all the time. But when you're in it for the very first time, for the first three months, if something goes up, you're like, oh my God, I'm genius. And then it drops, you're like, oh my God, why didn't I take it out? So you just go through all of these things that happens naturally. But when you're only doing paper, it means nothing, because nothing is attached to it. And so I think that's the same thing with AI.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Sure, you know how important AI is, but you go, well, I'm not as advanced as Jim using Gronk and doing all the stuff. Yeah, but we all started somewhere, right? Yeah, exactly. And I think that we got to stop losing. We got to start, and this is where, because I hang around a lot of friends who are really brilliant in AI. I've been in AI space for years or decades.

Who was a month ago?

If I know this feeling of where you just feel like you're so behind. So sometimes you just probably don't even bother trying it. But what I realized that that's just a terrible way of doing things, right? Because what you start to realize is that now that if you don't start, you should have you, this is your own game, your own journey, you got to start somewhere. And therefore, if you don't start using yourself, then it's gonna be very difficult. So my advice is just go on, pick one that doesn't matter. It'd be chat, GBT, Claude, Gronk, Gemini, whatever. just use it every day. And you might think that's crazy. When I first heard that, I'm like, every day? What are you talking about? This is only about six months ago. When someone told me to use this every day, I'm like, there's no way I'm gonna use this every day. I don't think a day goes by without me opening my ChatGPT uh app, you know, and using it multiple times a day, right? And I realized I'm so reliant on it now because it's just so much faster and evolving, and it gives me information that is relevant and is helpful to kind of get me information faster than anything else. And so I think using it every day is a smart thing. It could be the smallest thing. You start small. It's just like, you know, tell me about, I don't know, tell me about your weather, whatever, like whatever thing you want to chest out, but you go down what you call the rabbit hole. Once you start going into it, then you start diving into things that you're interested in. And all of a sudden you just go down to the rabbit hole. And I would ask everybody to listen to this, reflect upon any, like think about one thing that you are great at more than most people around you.

Yep. Yep.

Right? Like doesn't matter what skill, whatever. the only reason why you're really good at that, not, not you will call it naturally is because you spend more time or more interest or you put value into that one thing than most people would have. And that's the 100, you know, those thousand hours or 10,000 hours of what we talked about. And if you think about the hour, a hundred hours, what you said, it's true. Like if that's one hour a day for three months, right? 90 days and you'll get. to very close to being more knowledgeable than someone else. But again, you're always going to not be enough. So therefore you just decide to, I want to go further?

Yeah. And I think that that's, I just can't fathom the concept of being aware of something and not, you know, it's different whether it's an interest, but it's like, guys, this is, this is really important. You know how you, you know, when, when there's danger and someone, you're watching a movie and someone's tapping someone's shoulder and go, dude, there's danger here and someone's oblivious to it. You want to be the guy who's tapping everybody on the shoulder. And going, Hey, there's something going on here. I don't know what it is, but I just, sense that that's the case. So to me, I think that's just getting a pulse of what's going on. And, and like you said, uh, along the lines of, being open to try some things, I, you know, we always say in martial arts, you know, adopted beginners mindset. And I had a perfect example recently where I went to a class and a guy who's, um, same rank as I did, forgot his, his, um, his belt. And, uh, he's, he was running the class and he forgot to bring his belt and, and I go, Hey, do you my belt? goes, nah, like how well, you know, we talk about this beginner's mindset. I'm just going to wear this a white belt. He just took the class and white belt. Right. And being okay, visually representing this to people, even though he's got, he's earned his stripes and he's rank at a much higher level to be able to go, well, that's the mindset because being okay to go back to basics and risk.

Hmm.

feeling silly or clunky or haven't done this before or whatever, but yeah, I think it's just a willingness to take shots. Like we've said before with growing, but Wayne Gretzky, just, do it, do it. Don't, don't line it all up. And you know, the whole cattle station depends on that coming, coming through, but just invest it, date it for a little while, find out what your interests are. And that's the pathway to start forward.

Yeah. Well, some things of interest, like I, I was thinking about this the other day and really shifted my mindset and hopefully it will shift in some of your, uh, some, some of the listeners. I was on a retreat with my tiger 21 members, right. And, and we were on a retreat and we're sitting in a car or driving somewhere and we were having a conversation and someone, one of the members was saying, you know, how they share like a chat GPT account with everybody in the family. So everybody uses one account, right. And Which is kind of funny and ironic, right? These are the ultra rich and ultra high net worth and they only want to pay $20 or $25 a month. And the other member called out the other person and goes, let me get this straight. You have one account for all four of your family members. He goes, yeah, so it's like, why do need more? He goes, so you don't want to pay $25 a month for the most transformative technology that humankind has ever seen in our lifetime right now. You don't want to pay the extra $25 a month to

Yeah. Yeah.

help your kids discover this. And I'm when I heard that I'm like, oh, I'm such a cheap ass. Yeah, I'm like, oh my so I went home and I said to my kids, I'm like, listen, if you want a full version on chat, GPT, like, let me like, I'm happy to pay for it. You know, my son's like, I don't use it. I'm actually got me going. Why aren't you using it? Anyways, so then my daughter's like, yes, please. And then so I got her and now she's like, thank you, dad, like this is I never but because I have a

When you put it that way, when you put it that way.

paid account, I don't realize that they don't have like, I don't know what the limitations are, right. um And, you know, so now that she has full access, she's like, Oh, my god, this like she is on fire. She just like typing, do all these things.

Well, that's tapping into her. If she's got creative element, which she does, this is actually the multiplier effect of those skills. You're not having to wait for approval, whatever, you just test and measure. the lag time between, because it's funny, I was listening to Elon, right? Elon Musk talking, where people are just bagging him out for crashing all these rockets. And they go, dude, we're not.

Yes.

We're not crashing them because they're not working. We're crushing them because we're pushing them to the limit to work out its capacity. So you don't know how far you can go until you test it. And so that's part of your due diligence. So she is going, her idea to implementation lag time is going down in a nanosecond. So imagine how many ideas will get processed and how many ones that will take months are ready in like minutes and days.

Yeah.

and you've got proof of concepts so much faster than you ever could have.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly right. So I've given her all these tools, like some of the things I've already subscribed to, you know, some vibe coding stuff, like I'm going, Hey, listen, I got some free credits. It's we're going to expire in like two, five days, go for it, you know, and she just randomly just built like five different sites and, know, and that's what I want. Like just think about the learning of a child, right? That's what we are. We're, we're, we're, children here. We're just learning how to process and there's no way you can do that. Theoretically.

Yeah.

Like you literally have to do this in real time to test what you don't know, ah what works, what doesn't work, you know, how, what the limitations are. Some of these AIs, like some of the answers are terrible. You're like, no, that's not it. But maybe it's not the AI, maybe it's the way you asked it, right? Maybe it's the questioning, the way you prompt it. Like you got to get better at doing it. And basically AI is a machine, which is garbage in, garbage out. So if you're terrible prompt, ah or you're going to input a terrible prompt, you're to get terrible output.

Yeah. Yep. Yeah.

That's not the fault of the AI, that's the fault of you as the user.

Hmm. So if someone listening to this is thinking that it's about AI, think that's just, we could have been talking about marshmallows and, it's not about the marshmallows. It's not about the AI. It's about the tools, implementation, challenging yourself, trying different things. And if you take that and apply that to a particular area, your industry, that's what we're talking about. It's just obviously the AI and

Yes.

All the things we've talked about are the entry points to this discussion that is giving it fuel. And that's probably uh influencing where we're going in terms of what we're, what we're interested in because we see the applicability of it. But I think it's, it's a much bigger issue than, bigger topic than just what we're talking about, about AI. Yeah.

Yeah, to summarize this, right, what you just sort of said is that if you are happy, like really happy about where you are in life and business, and like I can't see anything else, fine, right? But most of us are in life and business to go, I'm happy, but there are certain things I would love to improve on. And if you continue doing the same thing over and over again, you already know where I'm going with this, right? It's gonna be the same thing, and you're always gonna be having this gap. So there's gotta be at some point in your life to kinda go and to sit back and reevaluate and going, am I willing to change what I'm doing or learn something new in order for me to get a different outcome, right? And you can't be doing the same thing. And I see this a lot with a lot of practitioners. They just keep on doing the same thing, hoping for a different outcome, which is the definition of insanity, right? What we've gotta do is what are you willing to shift? And we've been talking a lot about this. You know, and I both looking at like, What are we willing to change? And the answer is not gonna come in a nanosecond. I mean, we've been talking about this for months. We don't have a proper answer. Why? Because we're both testing things behind the scenes to see what's sticking. And maybe in six months time or one year time now when we do a podcast, you're like, wow, congratulations, Jim, like that move decision. Jim, what made you so successful? Right? And you may be to go like, well, there's one decision. No, it was the...

Yeah.

You know, the months and accumulation of thought, trial and error that got you to that point that made you successful at that point. That's where I see, and I think that's what we are going to be willing to test it.

Yeah. That's it. So Lawrence, just as we finish up, it's going to be another three weeks before we catch up recording. I've got an event this weekend in Amsterdam. Tell us about what you're doing in the next few weeks.

Well, I'm heading off to Bali and I'm going to head off to Bali to run a retreat and with my members and we, you know, we do our yearly retreat and this is the exact thing that I want to do. I want to take some time. want them to take some time away for us to reflect upon what worked, what didn't work this year and start planning for, you know, the next year and visualizing what the next three years is going to look like, but adapting to the principles on how can we, you know, utilize the technology that's available to make you more. efficient, more more freedom in your life and more profitability. That's what I'm doing. I'm traveling around and heading off to Abu Dhabi on the way back for the first time. I've never been there and I didn't realize Abu Dhabi is only in one hour from Dubai. So I'm like actually going to maybe go to Dubai, catch up with some friends and have some meetings and head back to as well. So, had was great because Eddie had offered two night free accommodation. Yeah, yeah, two free of commerce. So I'm like, I must take full advantage of that and stop in a country I've never been to. m

Hmm. They do. They allow you to stop. Yeah. Stay over. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Our son, did that as well too. When he flew, uh, he basically did the same thing. Stated in Abu Dhabi, sorry, Dubai, uh, for a couple of days. So it's a really great opportunity. So pick up some sun, um, from Bali or, uh, basically Abu Dhabi. I'll leave it up to you. Drop it.

Man.

Basically as a drop ship over Scotland when you're flying back to Portugal, if you could, uh, cause it's going to start getting a bit fresher now. I've adapted to it much better this year. Like second year, you kind of adapt to it. That first year was brutal. This way I'm like, I'm just walking around like a baller going, it's November. I'm nowhere near as cold as I was last year, but you're in a short sleeve T-shirt and I'm rugged up with thermal. So,

Yeah, second year, yeah. I am. It's starting to get cold. It's starting to get cold.

Just get you've got that Portuguese flex of like it's still pretty comfortable here. So enjoy man. I'll look forward to catching up again in a few weeks

All right, man, soon. Take care, see ya.