Taming Our Inner Voice

Welcome to another edition of Wabi Sabi and Jim and I got a great topic today because I think this topic relates to every single listener viewer. Uh, definitely relates to me on a regular basis and it's the topic of taming our inner voice. Now I'm going to start by talking about the inner voice. I think there's a, you know, for a long, long time, I, and I probably still actually stuck, I'll miss, I'll admit that the inner voice does not stop. Talking like. I don't know what's going on, but it's like, you think you got it handled, and we talk about like transformation and all that, but I know like at 40 years old, I know that the inner voice is still loud, and it's still there, and it never goes away. And we'll talk about like, you know, whether it gets louder or is it getting quieter, or how are we taming it? And, but I think the first is being aware that we actually have an inner voice, and that inner voice is different than the voice of the champion that you should be. So we'll start there.

Hmm, I like it. I like it. Well, there's so many directions that we can go through there. We can talk about the negative and positive sides of that inner voice because we can actually channel that to inspire us to level up and do something greater than the current scenario, or it can paralyze us into fear, doubt, uncertainty, all those components. So is there one that you want to start off with first, Lawrence?

Yeah, no, I don't have any particular direction on terms of which one, because I can go off on any one of these. So I'll let you choose today, Jim.

Okay. I'm going to start with how powerful the inner voice can be. All right. So I'm going to share a quick story. I have shared this before. So it's common knowledge, but when I, I learned to listen and trust my inner voice when I was probably seven or eight, long story short, we were, my brother and I were two kids playing in a house at our friend's house and we were running around the house playing show and tell a hide and seek, I should say.

Okay.

And we ran into a parents, the family, the mum and dad of the kids we were playing with, ran into the bedroom and hiding behind the curtains was one of the boys, but next to him was a gun. And I picked up this gun and fascinated by it. I was like, hey, this is phenomenal. Great. I can, I can really start leveling up my game and playing. So I took it out, took it outside. I'm abbreviating this story because it could take quite a while. But when I went outside, I picked up the rifle and put it to my brother's head. He was probably two, two and a half years old. And I was about to pull the trigger, thinking this is a great game. And just at that moment, I heard this, don't do it, inside my head. Don't do it was like the clearest message I could ever get. And I actually listened to it. And I moved the gun away from my brother's head, fired the gun and this huge explosion went off. So. In that moment, I realized I could actually kill my brother. Right. And in that moment, it was also the biggest lesson for me to trust intuition, trust the inner voice. Now that doesn't always mean that the messages coming through are as clear and as life changing as that, but I wanted to start with that because we can use this for good or we can use this for evil. And in that instance, it was one example of how it really transformed my life by listening to it.

Sliding door moment, right? I, you know, I mean, I think like, if they didn't list that voice, I don't think we'll be right here talking right now. You know, it would have been a different circumstances. I don't know where, like I've heard that story a couple of times now and I don't, just leaves me aghast and speechless again. And I almost don't know where to go from here, but I'll share something with the invoice that you just kind of triggered my thoughts around this. This literally happened to me last week, right?

We, yeah, no, not at all.

not to anywhere to the extent, but what I guess I want to contrast is that the inner voice is there for small things and also for very, very big things too. So we have, we were putting some air conditioning in our house. And one of the things that we couldn't, my wife wanted to put a certain picture in a certain wall and we needed the air conditioning to go up first so that we can put it the right place and make sure it's all right. And, uh, and the guy, the guy installing the air condition was graciously enough to go, yeah, happy to put it up for you. I don't have to go do it like perfect. So I want us to do it for it. Cause me and putting things up handyman situation, like I can do it, but I've just, it would take me five times as long. And because there was, there's like a whole bunch of like electrical stuff there too. And I was like, what worried about it? What happens if I drill through some electrical wire? I'm like, I'm just, I don't even want to touch this right with a 10 foot pole. Anyways, long story short, he was measuring it. Da da da.

Hahaha! Yeah, not much strength either, Lawrence.

And I, you know, was holding up the picture to like, Karen, what do you think, you know? And I, you know, she's like, okay, that's right there. Measured it up. I'm like, all right, so I put it down. And there was like this inner voice that says, I think you should move that painting onto the picture. And I'm like, I'm like, it's silly. And then Karen called me and she said like, hey, could you come and help me do something? I'm like, so I went and do that thing. Next thing I know downstairs, bang! I'm like, I heard it. I'm like, well, it's just a worker. Probably just dropped something, whatever. And next thing I know, I'll come back upstairs and sure enough, that exact picture with the glass frame, um, cracked. He fell over and, you know, poor guy and, uh, he felt so bad. He, I think he was almost in tears. Um, but you know, like I said, don't worry. It's a picture. It's okay. Like, you know, as long as you're not hurt, whatever, but this is a small thing. Right. And it's like, and this has happened to me multiple times where I just going, okay, is that just weird? Is that freaky? You know, is it just like,

out.

You know, it's a coincidence, but it's like, it was clear. It was pretty crystal clear. Like don't put it there. And I didn't listen to it. I'm like, got something else busy to do. And I think these kind of instances constantly happen. Now, I don't know, Jim, like we can say it's like, Oh, this is like, you know, whatever, or is it, you know, confirmation bias? I don't know. Like, where do you want to leave that topic?

My question is what, like in the first instance, it's actually a really good contrast. It's actually a really good thing. And I thought I'd start off with a story to set a frame for how this could go, but what stops us from listening to that inner voice and what makes us listen to it is probably the question that comes out for me. Like, I can tell you there's times where I haven't listened to my inner voice and just as well, but I've sat with my example. many a times and going, what made me in that moment listen to it? And in your case, what made you not listen to your voice, your inner voice? So I think that's a really important thing to unpackage first. All right. So what stops us from listening to your inner voice?

Yeah. Yeah, I think sometimes it's like you, I'm just kind of dissected in my head, like just in real time here. I think what stopped me from listening to my inner voice was that it wasn't that big of a deal. I'm like, I was probably not, you know, my brain just goes, my other voice said, I mean, come on, like what are the chances of that ever happening, you know? And, you know, why bother? It's not that big of a deal. Like it's, and then it's partly like split second of laziness. to just go and pick it up and move it somewhere else. Two, maybe like thinking like, oh, now I have to pick it up then I have to think about how long, I'm gonna waste a bit of time trying to figure where do I put it next? And inconvenience and distraction. Like Karen kind of called me down and then my thought just went from one pattern to, oh, I gotta do something else now and totally forgot about it. And the situation wasn't that important for me to go, hmm. stick with this a little bit, like, just hold on a minute, Karen, I need to go and make a decision. So it wasn't like the priority at that time for that picture wasn't like a massive priority. So therefore it didn't warrant a necessarily like, oh, I better like really figure this out. I think those are probably several reasons why I didn't actually listen to that voice at that given time.

That's actually really interesting you say that because a lot of the times, I think when I dissect situations like that as well, where I didn't realize the importance of the moment and hindsight's a wonderful thing. We can look back and go, gee, that would have been great to listen to, et cetera, et cetera, or I should have listed. But I think that highlights that point is where we rate it relative to the level of importance. So how do we see this task? And if we look at it and go, it's just really a choice or a values expression. and nothing else, then we probably will do that. But if we categorize it as this is a life defining moment, you need to listen, then I think it tunes us in to the situation and we really pay attention and go, this is really important. What do I really want here? As opposed to something flippantly just going, yeah, and I would have done the same thing too Lawrence, many a times where I, you know, a few weeks ago, I went to the gym, I left my all my belongings in the, in the, um, the locker while I went and trained and, and as I was putting the lock on, under the locker, I thought, gee, that doesn't catch very well. I probably should move it. Nah, probably I'll leave it. And I left and halfway, you know, out of my workshop, that locker must've opened up and all my belongings were gone. Now, you know, so I kicked myself. I didn't listen. I didn't all, I went through exactly what you're talking about. The happiest story ending to that story is that someone

Hmm.

passed it all in to reception, I got all that stuff back. But I had a situation at that time where I went, here's, I had an inkling, I didn't listen to it, probably for the same reasons that you did. And yet there was an outcome that I didn't anticipate. So what was it about that moment that I didn't listen to? Probably exactly the same thing that you'd mentioned.

Yeah. And so I think it's a really good dissection of like, you know, why we don't listen, but here's the freaky part. Do you remember the matrix? I'm watching the matrix and there's the one scene where, um, uh, I can't remember what her name is. So she's the one, uh, she's like, no, she's not the one she's like the Oracle and the Oracle was baking cookies. And then Oracle says to Morpheus, I don't know. So Neo and says, um, watch out for that. And then he's like, watch out for what? And then he turns and then crashes the vase and, uh, and then

Yes, love it, love it. Yep.

Then the next line she says, she goes, or something to this, it's been a while since I watched me, but she says something like, now the freaky thing is, is that would you have actually broke the ways if I didn't tell you to avoid it? And so where am I going with this? I goes, well, sometimes when you think, okay, well, it's bad that we cracked the mirror, sorry, the picture that we did. However, it actually led to a conversation that, with my wife and I and how we reacted in terms of how she reacted to the man who broke.

Mmm.

uh, you know, the worker who broke the, uh, the picture and how gentle she was and not caring, um, about, you know, what happened to the picture and, and almost reassuring, it's okay. Like, don't worry. You know, it's, you know, we'll cover it. Don't worry. You don't have to stress. Um, you know, for a worker, especially in a Portuguese worker, like it might be like thinking that might be a very expensive picture and then, you know, worrying about how I'm going to pay for this kind of thing. And so she was very reassuring. to him that it's going to be okay. Like, more importantly, are you okay? Did you get hurt? You know? And, but then like in hindsight, the conversation, this is going to be a different topic where, you know, she really reflected upon thinking about, well, how do I necessarily react to the kids when that happens? You know? And, meaning like,

Hmm. Mmm.

I don't, I almost harder on my kids when, you know, something, if they broke something versus like a complete stranger who broke something, he's more gentle. And then we started having that conversation like how, how is that right or wrong? You know, and we're not trying to write wrong, but it just, it really led to this deeper conversation around like, man, you know, sometimes like, why is it that we're so kind of this stranger than our own family sometimes? And so, and that, so, so now you go, well, the picture was broken, you know,

Yeah, yeah. Hmm, interesting.

you know, crap, it was too bad. But then it actually led to another conversation, you know, to something that could be better for our kids. And because now she may have learned something or both of us can learn something to go, okay, let's be, you know, utilize this to kind of learning. So we wouldn't have got that if this person didn't, you know, break the glass and the glass wouldn't broken if I actually moved the picture. So like you see going, well, which one, which scenario, which reality, yeah, which reality is as good or bad. And it's like going back to that, oh, you know, proverb of...

Yeah, is it good? Is it bad? Yeah, yeah.

you know, the man, the Chinese man, that's a different story I don't want to kind of go into. But it's just like one of those things we just don't know, right? We don't know which is good or which is bad, which reality you're supposed to live in and these parallel universes that, you know, that could be out there. But yeah, so I mean, I didn't want to open up the rabbit hole, but I just kind of want to highlight that.

No, but I think it's a really good point. I'm gonna add another spin and add some stuff that we talked about offline before we got on to record where we talked about the importance of time, right? And time tends to give you perspective as to whether it was a good or bad decision. And the context of it, if I may share, Lawrence, for anybody watching the video, Lawrence got a really sharp hairstyle today. And I said to him, dude, turn to the left, turn to the right. looking very sharp and he said, I had it a week ago. And we're talking about that. And you mentioned that your son wasn't overly wrapped with it and he gave you some feedback. And the joke about it was, look, the difference between a good and bad haircut is two weeks. So it's perspective, right? I think it looks great. It probably will look even better if that's the case. But it's effectively time quite often gives you the context of whether things turned out well or not. And

Nope, he was not happy.

how you interpret a situation. So you've got the situation, you've got your experience to it, and then you're learning from it. And in that situation, that's what I saw that you did, which I thought was a really good thread to follow through was you had a situation you didn't listen to in a voice, you had an experience or an event, and that led to greater learnings and distinctions later on.

And so it opens up the question whether or not like listening to our voice or not listening to a voice or even like going left or right, you know, the circumstances I think on how you feel about those circumstances really comes down to how you choose to feel or how you choose to see the world, right? Because if I went left and moved the picture, I would have had a different reality and I've, you know, I went right instead and I had it, you know, the reality I'm currently living in. And so I think both circumstances requires the thought process of ensuring that I choose to the reality or the perception of that reality to be in favorable of my life or to better my life. Because I could have easily gone down the way and gone man, beat myself up for not listening, right? And then therefore I would have a story of caution. Even then though. would be a lesson because I would have said, oh, I should have listened to my voice next time, I'm gonna listen to my voice. And so therefore, even then, I guess what I'm saying is that I'm constantly creating a better reality, or at least how I see the reality, even no matter how bad it actually gets. I try to go, I try to see the upside. I try to see how this is beneficial. I try to see the benefits, but like you said, time, it does require time for you sometimes to actually see the full benefit. And that could be very difficult to kind of go through. But that took a long time for me to kind of get to this place, to not be reactionary, and but to know that I get to choose and dictate the life that I want to have and the type of life I want to have. So it's such an important element, I think, that we need to really kind of consider that you are in constant flux, but you're also in constant... Um, you have constant choice to really be able to see the world the way you want to see it.

Lovely. And so let's look at it from another perspective then where you're daringly pursuing a vision and a dream and you go all in on it and you're getting feedback from everybody else and noise that you're crazy. What do you think you're doing? Who are you to do this? You know, how dare you? This is ridiculous. It's beyond all those kind of negative topics and associations that people have and you're in a voice either supports that and listens to that or says, no, I'm actually not going to listen to the distractions. How about we put some discussion into that one as well too, because I know I've definitely had situations where it was my inner knowing that kept me going. And sometimes I had to get really clear on whether it was stubbornness or ego that kept me going when I should have made a better distinction and what stopped me from course correcting. So let's have a look. channel that little chestnut there.

Yeah. So you have an, do you have an example of when that might have happened to you? Like, let's, let's kind of talk through that and then, and then we can, let's dissect.

Okay. So a classic scenario for me, funny enough was So when I studied, before I got into chiropractic, my course, I didn't get in straight away. I did a science course first. And I went to uni with a guy who I was working with. And I was working for these mom and dad at a seven 11 store, a 24 hour convenience store in, in Melbourne. And I remember going through and studying with this guy and then saying, I've got a vision of, I've wanted to be a chiropractor for my whole. whole life and, and they kept on saying, look, it's ridiculous. Why are you doing that? You already, you know, who are you? So I think the catalyst for really wanting to talk about this today was really that story came to mind. And I got so much heat and shade thrown on me about this is not possible for you. You're, you're, you're dreaming too big, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And I got in and I actually didn't listen to them and I didn't get in the first time. first year, I got in after second year, mucked around first year, that's another story. But I got in because I was pigheaded enough and stubborn enough to keep following through that. And I didn't buy into their vision and version of what I thought was, what they thought was possible for me. So that's one example when I did that.

Mm. Yeah, like I think one of the things, it's very challenging not to, especially when you're younger, to not to be, fall into the trap of listening to other people that are around you. And so there's two things, right? We already did an episode around this about surrounding yourself with the five close, the five closest people around you is gonna really change the perspective of who you are and who you're gonna become. So, you know, go back and listen to that episode. I think it's a really vital one to kind of listen to. But you know, the challenge of course is that we are social beings and being social beings, we are really tied into constantly wanting to the approval of our tribe and our community and making sure that our community, you know, approves of us. And no matter how much you say, I don't care what other people think, we all care about what. how the people think it just to the extent of who you're choosing to care about, right? Who cares about you in terms of who you, sorry, who you care about as a pin, like whose opinion you care about. And so I think that's really important to have that key distinction about, you know, everybody, it's human nature, first of all, that everybody is going to be prone to it. And because of that human nature, we are prone to create biases in our heads that may help us or may push us towards a direction and decision that we may not actually want. And so this is where the challenge becomes. And you know, for you, like you didn't listen to the voices of others and you decided to pursue your own voice, that takes guts and that takes courage, which we've done a podcast on that too as well. And that's very challenging for any of us to kind of do. But I think every single time you actually do that and you follow your true self and you follow your true voice and you see the the benefits and it creates evidence and proof to your life that I was right and everybody was wrong. I think that helps you to make better choices and listen to that voice even more. So I think for anybody who's like listening, who's in their 20s, for example, I find that a very challenging time. Like anybody who's in their teens or in their 20s is really challenging because you don't, you're typically... haven't really made most of your choices. Like typically the choices have been made for you or it's been created by biases around the people you surround yourself with, usually friends or family. And they've kind of directed you in a direction and that's their job. Like my job as a father is to help my daughter or help my son make better decisions. But let's face it, we actually do influence them in a lot of ways and by our behaviors and how we raise them. And we probably direct them and probably can push them in any direction that we want. However, and so therefore, when they're younger, you lack that ownership and that self-awareness to make those choices. And so it becomes very difficult to fight against that. And that's what I mean by courage. I think it takes a lot of courage, especially the very first couple of times you do it, to find that courage to actually trust in yourself. And there's so many ways and so many paths to be able to get there, to get to that point if you're even having enough courage to do so. And I congratulate anybody who does that. But you have to do it on your own. You have to have real trust in yourself. But I think one of the key components of that is that you would have to know yourself well. You have to know what your values are and what matters to you the most. And that takes a while to figure out. I'll use an example. I was in school once and I had a You know, I had probably about 15, 20 of our classmates or colleagues or friends, you know, and they were just having a party, we were just hanging out having a party or whatever it was, and they all decided to go, all right, let's go smoke a joint. And I remember this incident clearly because everybody cleared out of that living room. And I was stuck in that choice, right? I was like, you know, do I follow the crowd or do I stick to what my police were around that? I'm not saying it was right or wrong. And there's no judgment on my friends either. It was just like, it's not something I wanted to do. And I had to fight that. That takes a lot of like, I don't wanna say guts because I'm not trying to pat myself on the back, but it was like, it took a lot of effort in my mind to resist the temptation to just follow and just do. what everybody was doing. And that, I remember that clear, I literally was sitting there all by myself and was like, hmm, this is weird. This is really weird. I'm being comfortable with that situation.

And we talked about that in an episode as well too, about the courage, the courage to stand by your own convictions and how challenging that is, particularly in the developmental ages, as you mentioned in the teens and where groups and social networks are very, very important, they're developing in there. So a lot of the times, you raise a really good point there because The challenge and the conflict for a lot of people is to see something being done and inside you're going, this isn't a good idea or this isn't for me. And being swept up when it, you know, by virtue of your want to fit in your need to be part of a group and you're developing autonomy over self to go, Hey, this is what I believe and I'm going to stay true to it. But that that's not an easy step and an easy process. You know, when you've got influential people around you and perhaps you have tried very hard to fit into a group, I can see where it's a perfect storm for someone to be swept up and not listen to their inner voice, knowing that they're going against what their inner wisdom is telling them isn't a good idea for them. But the need to fit in at some level is more important than to listen to that.

Yeah, and I think the parents are probably the one of the most challenging things to fight against, you know, because I know that. I know how I'm gonna say this right now and it's gonna be recorded and I wouldn't go exactly how I'm not gonna say it before, but I do my very, very best. I try my very best, try not to, you know, make a decision for my kids. I try to let them, I mean, I'll be, I'm sure I influence their decisions, but I try to let them come to their own conclusions as best as I possibly can. And I think that the reality is that I know that when my parents want certain things for me, or they say this is better for me, I feel like there's, it's hard to resist that it's hard to resist like someone who's raised you to really kind of go, you know, you're wrong. I think I'm going to go in this path. And I believe that I'm right. And it's not about being right or wrong is but being able to have that autonomy to be able to have that freedom of choice, to be able to know that you created the life that you have. But that takes responsibility. We'll come back, like, you know, coming back to that, it's like, it requires you to go that the life that you all have right now, you have to take responsibility for all the greatness that you've actually created in your life, which is amazing, which we all, I'm sure, we all take credit for. But we also have to take credit for all the crap and all the shit that we actually had created for our life too, you know? And I think it's important for us to kind of recognize that, you know, in order to take... the wins, you have to take the losses as well. But there's tremendous freedom, in my opinion, when I'm responsible and solely responsible for my life, meaning like for all the good that has happened in my life, it's because of me. And yes, of course there's a bit of luck in that, but I also created that luck by doing certain things and making certain decisions. But I also have to admit that for all the things that I've lost and regret, they're on me too. You know, it wasn't external circumstances. It's easy to blame, you know, a certain situation or maybe like the, you know, the recent couple of years or maybe like recession or interest, whatever. They can easily blame external factors. But at the same time, I don't think that helps you. I think it's important to go, yeah, that's the environment that we have to work with, but I still made those decisions based on the facts that I had at the time. And so... all I'm aggressive really saying here is like taking responsibility for you know, taking either you listen to your voice or you didn't listen to voice but be, you know, whether it became good or bad, like rather than having the judgment of that, be just be responsible, be responsible for the life that you have now. Because I, for me, by being responsible for your life that you have now, now gives you the power. And that power is that you the life of their future is on you now. Right? If you're responsible for all the good and bad that you've actually happened to this point in life, then now you have the power to shape the life that you wanna have in the next three, five, 10, 30 years of your life.

Yeah, you know what I thought of when you were talking about that was the difference between thoughts and inner voice. Because you can have a thought and a thought will be a random bubble that comes through. But in neuro linguistics, they say you are you are not your thoughts. You're the thinker of your thoughts, which ultimately gives you the power to make choice and distinctions based on whether that you buy into that thread or not. And so a lot of the times, the inner thought, the inner voices quite often are just rubbish thoughts that run through our mind that we don't have to hang our hat on and go, I thought it, so that's, that's what it is. And the distinction is no, you don't. Because those thoughts quite often may be influenced by, as you said, external factors, other people, but you don't have to buy into those because they may not be true for you. So there's wisdom in coming from the ability to differentiate and discern the difference between your own truth and the inner voice, the inner voice of the projections of other people. You know, just on that Lawrence, I was just going to say that a very important distinction I learned a lot of a long time ago was when you hear those inner voices, try to locate whose voice that is. You know, because if it's the voice of your mum or your dad, or you can get some

Hmm.

where that's coming from. If it's coming from, I think, relaying it back to the first story that I had was to me, there was no other point other than universal intelligence or something higher power, because that was a really clear message. But there are other times I've had inner voices where I go, that's my mom talking, that's my dad talking. And am I living through their expressions through me or is this really truth for me?

Mm. You know, there's, that reminded me of when Jeff Spencer taught me something and I thought was really, really powerful and I'll share it with you, share with everybody. And it's basically he said to me once, he goes, you know, one of the most important point is like, you should really kind of get a sense of where, if you're in fear, and the feeling is fear, where, where in your body do you feel it? Okay. And then when it's pure joy, And it's just like, this is just aligned with your values and your soul and it touches your soul. Where do you feel that? And it's different for everybody. Like some people feel it in their head. Some people like if fear might be in their head, it might be in their stomach or whatever. And you know, joy might be in their heart or in their stomach. It doesn't really matter where it is. It's more that you are tuned to that. So fear and joy. So that's the first step. That's step number one. Step number two is that next time, whenever your voice comes up, when something tells you a certain thing, because you have that baseline of knowing and understanding where fear or joy comes from, then you really kind of have a baseline to evaluate whatever that voice and thought might be, what you were talking about. If something says, you should go and do this, is that coming out of fear or is that coming out of joy? Is it pulling you or is it pushing you? And I think that's a really good exercise to do when there's no emotion. Like the first part of that exercise, you need to do it when you're not in fear or joy. Like it's just, like you're just neutral. Because then you're not being biased and really start to think about like, when I'm in fear, where do I feel this part of my body? And when I'm in joy, where do I feel this part of my body? So then now you have a baseline. And next time you sort of have a conundrum or when you're actually feeling something, you're not sure where it's coming from. Is it out of the fear or joy? Then really, then you can kind of go like, is it coming from my head or is it coming from my stomach or is it coming from... And that may give you some clues of where that voice is actually coming from. Is it your voice that's telling you out of fear or is that the voice that's telling you out of joy?

Yeah, that's a great way to discern the basis of the voice, the feedback and the quality of the feedback you're getting as well too. So how about we shift gears and I'll ask you a question. Okay, so imagine you are locked on and you are ignoring advice that's life threatening. You know, like people are saying to you, dude, don't jump off the cliff without a parachute. And you're like, no, I'm gonna do it. Like that kind of scenario. So...

Hmm Ha ha.

What is it that stops us from heeding exceptionally good advice? because we don't, what would stop someone from basically listening to a convention and not actually course correct.

I think it's ego. Like, you know, for me, it's ego is always the, you know, ego is the first thing that comes to my mind is because, you know, you usually only get into that state of way of thinking is because you feel like you're untouchable and you're almost like God and that everything you do and everything, so far so good, you know, like it's like playing a hand of, you know, several rounds of poker or something or gambling and you're like, I want a massive winning streak and nothing's going to stop me. And sometimes it's

Yeah, that's what I would have said too, yeah.

great to feel invincible. I think it's important to feel invincible, right? And everything that we talk about is always in balance, right? We always talk about like, how do you build enough momentum where you feel like you're invincible and unstoppable, you can actually go and do whatever you want to do, right? And there's a lot of, I just finished reading a book and literally the last chapter was talking about, you know, go out there. Like only thing that stops you from, you know, living your life and, you know, getting all the financial rewards you ever want is fear. just like, and you're all gonna die anyway. So then just talked about that. I'm like, you know, it's so true, right? It's absolutely true. But at the same time, you can also do something like that and just be stupid, right? Cause it's like, you know, the advice is like, just live your life as you know, there's no tomorrow. Okay, but that kind of lifestyle also ensures like the higher probability of you maybe living a great life, but also, you know, shortens your life too by living dangerously. And... So it's really about the balance of those two kind of way of thinking. So like in anything in life, I don't think any extreme is probably too much of one thing. And it's about recognizing who you are. And it comes down to self again. Where do you fit? Because your middle ground or your middle may be different than mine. And it's not right or wrong, but you got to find that balance. And so yeah, I would say ego is the number one thing that stops us from heeding to those advice of others. because you're so blinded by the pursuit of the goal and blinded by your own success and thinking that you are not gonna fail.

Yeah, I agree with you totally there. That's, that's, I guess I asked the question having a concept of what I thought it was, and I, it was great to hear that you felt it was the same way. We're both either correct or we're both wrong. And you know, in that, in that regard, what I, I've always, and it's come up before in a previous conversation with us where, how do you know the, what voice to listen to up until a point where it serves you and then at what point do you need to change that to tell a different narrative and story? Because when you talked about the invincibility when you're in the Zion and flow, you're telling yourself a different story as opposed to when things aren't going your way. So it's important that the story or the narrative or the internal voice is life-affirming and it's helping you progress and move forward. If it's actually in defense mode and it's negative, then it's obviously drawing you from good decisions and choices, that's a different thing. That's, I think always the challenge that I found even in my own life and even other people is what's the point where it switches at what, how do you, how do you gain wisdom? How can you put an old head onto young shoulders, so to speak, to know at what point you need to course correct. You need to change, you need to change something about the inner voice or your motivations or your ego, whatever it is to take the feedback coming on.

I think it's getting harder and harder to do so because we're more and more exposed to outside noise that is very difficult to control. And so what I mean by that is like, if you go back, say 20 years, you know, the real voice that you really hear that can kind of influence you in certain directions are probably the people that you're surrounded by and maybe, you know, whatever media or medium that you're really kind of listening to or following through. But in the world of social media now, like you are constantly bombarded by people's voices and opinions that you don't even know or you're supposedly friends with and or you follow through and they, and they're louder and more influential because they know what soundbites can really change people's narratives. And this includes the media. I'm not saying like it's not just people, it's just also the media. And when the emotions are high, And when the stakes are higher, you can really tell that by being further at the end of the spectrum, you actually create a situation where the person who's voicing out that opinion actually gets rallying cries from those people at the end to create more confirmation bias for you to become more like that. So your voice gets louder and louder towards the left, the right or whatever the spectrum is, and more away from the middle. And we're in this situation right now, right? We are in this situation right now politically and societally where every topic has like a left and a right opinion. And then they're all, most of the time is so freaking extreme, we barely have a chance to even debate the middle. And so why am I saying all this to answer your question? Well, it's, what I'm saying is that is so difficult. It's almost like trying to listen to your own voice in the middle of a rock concert. because the voices are so loud on both sides of the aisle, you are so tempted to just listen to some, because it's so much easier to give your opinions or your decisions to someone else and just let them make it for you, because then you know that you can have the excuse that you didn't do it, right? It wasn't your choice. And so what I think needs to be done is that, in order to like course correct, you have to be able to learn to shut out the noise on the outside. I think that's the only way and to minimize it at the very minimum, right? To have noise cancellation headphones, you know, block them all out because that's the only time where you actually get to listen to your own voice. But we're always so constantly distracted. That's what I'm saying. Like our, our so we're such an, a distracted society, not because the voices are louder, because we're allow ourselves to be distracted. We are not listening. We don't want to listen to our own voice. And we're not quietening enough. And I think this is where, you know, meditations or breath work or any of those type of things really helps with the mindfulness. It's really to calm that brain down to really going, what is the voice telling you? What is, what is your inner voice telling you? And I'm guilty of this, man. Like it's, it's a very tough environment to not hear the negatives, negativity and things around you. And you just get caught up and swept up in the emotion. We're just talking about this, you know, like, um, you know, with, with the family and saying how It's amazing like how, you know, let's just pick the most recent thing like, you know, with COVID and stuff and the height of all of that stuff. I hate keep on bringing this up, but like, it's the most memorable thing that we can all kind of go through and we've all had different perspective on it. Why? Because we all had different depending on how you saw things, you will see as different certain reality. And you know, in hindsight now, now that we're out of that situation, you look back and going, hmm, like, did I behave? in any way, irrational in any of those circumstances, right? And so this is not about judgment on right or wrong. This is more about just evaluating, like how did I get to that state of deciding that's the choice or having those choices that I made? You know, what took me there? What did I have to do? And it, you know, like for a lot of people, like you, we either got swept into the emotional, you know, emotional feeling of what you know, everybody was doing or not doing, then you most likely, you know, made certain choices based on that. I still remember just getting into the heat of the argument and you start realizing like, what am I doing? You know, and it's like, why are we even arguing? You know, like, and so I think to kind of course correct, I think requires you to really take a step back. One, to be able to quieten the noise. And two, this is where self-responsibility comes into play. This is where you gotta go, okay, Did I do something, have I made a mistake? Am I going the right direction? Am I choosing this based on ego? Am I doing this to actually base it on what I'm supposed to be basing on, which is my goal or how I wanna choose to live my life or whatever that thing is for you. I think when you then have that opportunity to be quiet in a voice and actually then question whether you're on the right course or not. At that point, you have to possibly have the probability of admitting failure, which is very difficult to do. And then if you're open to that, and this is where the mindset comes in, if your mindset allows you to go, you know what, I effed up, I made a mistake here. I'll take responsibility for that, that I am sorry for doing X or saying X. And I apologize.

Yeah.

I'm not making excuses, I know I was wrong, and I'm sorry. And I think having that mindset to be able to do that allows you to course correct. If you don't have that mindset, you will most likely double down on your initial decision and even push even harder.

So effectively what, if I'm understanding what you're saying is that what stops people from heeding advice is being closed off to it in the first place and not being open to possibilities. So there's a difference between collecting information and making your own decision as opposed to being influenced by people to act a certain way when you haven't really filtered it through your own values, your own wisdom to work out. what's the best thing. You know, one of the things that I thought of as you were talking about that, yes, look, the pandemic experience was a huge social experiment that we all got to see how people handled stress and uncertainty and all those kinds of things. So just for a moment, I'll put that aside. I'm reminded of the wisdom, inner wisdom of a young mother who has, who's having her first child. And... has so many competing opinions about how things should be done. You should be doing this, you should be doing that. You know, they've read every book on motherhood ever written. I know we went through this whole process. And then you get to a point where you just go, I could go this way, I could go this way. I've just got to trust what is in me, biologically the right thing. And I think that that's the point of power that comes when we actually.

Yeah.

Yeah, quieten down the noise externally. Use it for guidance, use it for reference. However, use our own internal compass to say, is this true for me? Does this resonate with me? Does this make sense? And this is the best interest of myself and my family. And I've seen situations where young moms, really young moms show wisdom way beyond their years because they're actually able to tap into that.

Yeah. That is such a brilliant example, because it's one of those moments that we've all experienced. And I think one of the reasons why we bring up, you know, the pandemic so much is because it's a shared experience throughout the world, no matter where you live in the world, most likely, or a higher probability that you understood collectively what that felt like. If I use an example of what happened in Australia, for example, you don't necessarily know what that felt like or any situation in Australia, because you're not necessarily Australian. You didn't go through it. It makes sense. And so that's why I think, you know, when we use examples of the pandemic to highlight some of these thoughts, you know, these patterns, is because we all, I believe all the listeners and viewers had some version of their feelings around it. But I think I like your example a lot too, is because, you know, for most of us who have had kids would have gone through that experience, especially if you're a woman. All these thoughts and all these things, people's conflicting. And it takes a lot to really like go. shut the noise because there's a period like, Oh my God, like you take on everybody's advice, you start doing all those things and nothing works. And then you like have to learn to shut that out. And I kind of look at this way. I go, my view point is that on anything right in life that requires that there's no Bible on it, like one path, right? There's like multiple ways of doing this thing and there's they're conflicting chances are. there's not one way of doing it. And so what, exactly, parenting is the perfect example. Like if there was a perfect way to parent and making sure you get XYZ kind of kid, then there will be a Bible for it. There's a certain way of doing this, it's a playbook, right? There's a playbook for it, chances are that, no, there's no playbook for parenting. There's a playbook for this, like for sleeping, but it's like, cry it out method.

I.E. parenting.

Let them all cry and just let them learn. And then the other way, the way on the other side would be like, no, you need to nurture and make them sleep in the bed. I'm not saying which way is better or not. I just know what way worked for us, but doesn't necessarily mean it's gonna work for your child because your child can be completely different and our values are different as parents. So anything, any topic that I find that has multiple playbooks, right away, it's one of those situations where I go. I need to ensure whatever playbook I choose to go for has to be within my values rather than just going pick and choose, internet influencers tell me this is the playbook you need to have.

Yeah, I think another thing that I've found out as well to Lawrence around that is where confusion came into it is when I was partly immersed in either approach or strategy without actually seeing it run all the way through, i.e. that time thing that we were talking about. So if I made a decision and let's say it was the decision on the right, for example, and if after one step or two step, I... changed it to the left and then went back to the right and then to the left. That's only creating confusion because the reality is both the left hand, the left or the right option may get me to where I want to, but I actually haven't seen it through. And so what I tried to do was to go, okay, I'm gonna follow this path and I'm gonna give it the time that is recommended. And if they say to me, it takes X amount of time, then I will see it through and I'll get to the end. And if it's still not there, then I'll change. But I have to give that an opportunity to work. Otherwise I'll never develop an understanding in myself of what worked or what didn't. And where I found confusion and I find with a lot of people is when they oscillate because they're not certain in themselves, they go, maybe it's this, maybe it's that, and that indecision, that lack of decisiveness in terms of what direction you go and we, you talked about it on a previous podcast about leadership and going, we're going that way. That shows conviction and that helps you build up. Trust in self, which is what reinforces that inner voice. So to me, decisiveness about which direction you're gonna go, irrespective of whether it's the right one at the time, will help you build up the credits in your own knowledge to then know what worked, what didn't, and when you needed to change.

You know, one of the things that I know where I struggled most in my life is usually when I didn't know what the next move was going to be. And, and in my head, I find that that's the biggest struggle I go through my own my headspace. Because that's usually when I'm not the snag and maybe the saddest or like, where I feel like I'm, I'm floating and not knowing what where I'm going. And, you know, and that's, and it reflects everywhere in my life. And usually in those moments where it's I start to realize over time, I recognize that the reason why I feel that way is because I wasn't committed to doing anything. Because I was so, I didn't have any clarity of any sort of future. And so therefore, I just sit and kind of wait and hoping that something will come to me. You know, and that the future will just show up and guide me. And the reality is, is that it never does. Because even when it does, even if it does show up, I still have to.

Hmm.

make a decision. And so basically all I'm doing is just avoiding decisions. And decision isn't about like choosing one way or the other, decision is also being deciding like, what direction you wanna go. And so when I worked through with my coaches and it took me many years to kind of get to this point, I go, whenever I feel that way, that was always the thing that I was lacking. And all I really have to do to get myself out of those situation is I just need to choose a direction. And what was clear to me is that it didn't really matter what direction it was. it just had to be a direction. Because it's better to have a direction and move forward than it is to have no direction and just sort of sit there. Because I think like that is like quicksand. Like you're just waiting for the world to swallow you up. And when you're sinking in quicksand, it doesn't matter if you go north, south, east or west, just pick a bloody direction and just get the hell out of the quicksand. You might decide to go north and realize that, you know, 100 kilometers in, you're like realizing, this is not the direction I wanna go. That's when you talked about changing course. Yeah, it's to recognize like, okay, it's okay. I don't wanna go north, I wanna go west. So I'm gonna have to head back in some sort of direction. So you might have to trace back. So what? At least you're not in quicksand. That's how I kind of think of myself. So if any of you who are kind of stuck in that situation of where like, I don't know what to do, I feel kind of sad, you know, I'm kind of stuck in this place, I'm kind of in transition, yeah. The reason why I think it's usually because you haven't chosen a direction, and it's okay. It's okay to live there for once in a while, but the choice is up to you to whether and how long you actually wanna live like that. And most people are trying to just do their job while they live like that. And the problem with that though, that lack of decision, three years go by, five years go by, and you don't realize how much time goes by, and then you go, man, you lost that opportunity. There was like multiple. multiple times because the train keeps going right time keeps going and you've lost that opportunity that you could have got off and went a different direction.

I like it. Lawrence, I was gonna finish up with, I guess, a synthesis of what I've understood during this whole discussion. And that would be that, you know, the inner voice is a really important guiding. It's like a messenger quite often. It can highlight danger. It can alert you to things that are survival-based and you want to listen to, and they can really serve you as I shared in my story. They can reflect your biggest doubts. of yourself, they can reflect the noises and the sounds and the voices of your detractors or people who are loved ones who are cautiously wanting the best for you. But you can start adopting their beliefs in your own thinking, your own voice. I think that you don't have to buy into every thought that you have. You can actually have capacity and discernment to decide what serves you and what doesn't. And finally that you can choose the narrative of the story that you tell yourself about yourself as part of your inner voice and use it to level yourself up, to use it as inspiration and motivation rather than buying into the negative side of it. I think that's, if I can condense 50 odd years of my learning to date, that'd probably be it in terms of the inner voice.

I think, oh, and with that, to know that you have multiple voices inside of you, there's multiple inner voices inside of you and you have to discern at any given moment, which were those voices actually speaking the loudest there? What Jim has highlighted is here is that, you know, you're talking about the voice that, you know, that, that guides you and leads you. I think we need to also know that there's the other voice, the other voice. We didn't really spend too much time on, which is the voice that Connor says you can't do this or the voice that, you know, it's like creating you to be the first version of yourself, not necessarily because they're trying to do that, but they're actually there in protection. And so knowing the difference between those two voices, we can call it the lizard voice, the dragon voice that I call that, that voice is there to really try to protect you. They're trying to save you, but they have a different objective. Their objective is to, their objective is more immediacy, meaning like it's mostly about them trying to be comfortable at that given moment. They want to protect you from, and create safety for you at that given moment in time. So their intentions are more short-lived. The other voice that you've been talking about, Jim, I think that voice is the one that thinks long-term. They're the one who is thinking like, the patterns for the future. They're the ones who, that voice is the one who's trying to tell you about, yes, you might have to go through some hardship, but the payoff is gonna be so much better. This is the champion voice, this is the greatness voice, this is the true... voice, I believe, I'll call it the true voice, the true voice that's actually inside of you. But they, they are, they're the long term focus. But what you need to understand is those two voices that the lizard brain, the dragon voice, often hijacks the true voice. Right. And you have to discern that at any given moment in time, which voice is it is it that's actually speaking the loudest at this moment in time. And that requires self-awareness and that requires you to quieten down the noise. And that requires for you to be able to know what the voices have been. And I think it's really important based on our conversation, I hope that all of you take back and go, look at your life and when has the lizard voice or the dragon voice have been dominating? And how did those events turn out? When has the true voice been dominating and how did those circumstances turn out? By going through and filtering your past decisions and and allowing yourself to really be okay with whatever decision you made in the past, you can learn from it so that you can get better at deciding which voice is actually stronger in the future. So guys, I hope that was helpful to really kind of really understand the voices that's inside of your head. I've learned a lot from Jim here, and I hope that you can take some of this and apply it to your life, and move and become the greatest version of yourself. That's what we're here for and hope that we can, using our shared journeys of our life. that help you in some way to improve yours. So until next week, until the next podcast of the Wabi Sabi, please share this with others and please comment and let us know how you think about these episodes. We'll talk to you soon.