Putting It All Out There

Welcome to Wabi Sabi. In this episode, we're going to talk about, you know, the thing, the emotions around every time I get on a podcast, to be honest with you, every time I get on the stage, every time I speak, I feel this feeling. And that feeling is about, you know, that nervous energy of, you know, putting something out there in the world and then being like worried about judgment. I'm going to talk everything about that, the process of leading that up to it, and also like the fear and that goes on to our heads. You might think Hey, listen, these two guys go on these podcasts and we just go and talk and whatever. But I guarantee you what the truth of the matter is behind the wheel. I don't know what Jim, I can't speak for Jim, but for me, like there's always that nervousness every time I put a camera on myself to do a video. Every time I do a podcast, anytime I've been doing this for years, you know, over 10 years, but every single time I still get this like nerves of going, should I press record? Should I not press record? And I'm just riffing here, but that's the nervous energy that I have. So Jim, I love to you to introduce this topic.

Yeah.

of putting it all out there.

Yeah, we will definitely will. And hello, everybody. I was just going to say, Lawrence, what we do to dissipate some of that nervous energy before we do a quick little check in, just basically put on a line, just almost, almost quiet and down that monkey brain in both of us. I try and have a bit of a laugh. If that makes sense, I think we'd subconsciously do it. We don't intensify. Okay, laugh now, but we prepare and we're ready to go. If we're not in the zone, we don't start. Right. So we have to just get ready, get

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

present, get clear, and then we get started. So yeah, so that's what we do to prepare us for that. So you're right, it's not always going to be perfect and you're not going to be always going, right, everything's ready to go. Sometimes you just got to go before you're ready, but this is what we do. And that's our preparation routine is to decrease the stress response. So the answer, yeah, the theme today really was about, was prompted because you and I both have had big lead ups in the last couple of weeks to some speaking events. And, you know, man, I spoke to a group of entrepreneurs yesterday and the talk went great and, but the prep, the lead up to it was a disaster. And I want to talk about that specifically. Right. So yeah, so you're curious, you know, and I deliberately didn't, I didn't tell you about this before because I wanted to hear you to hear it for the first time, because frankly, I wouldn't believe it if I'm telling myself this. So.

Okay. I haven't heard this story yet, so.

A guy I trained Jiu Jitsu with invited me to speak to a group of entrepreneurs here in town. And that's really the target audience of the people where I like to work with and do some of this work with, right? So I got invited and I said, yeah, happy to come along. And I was talking about some of the determinants of successful business and entrepreneurship. And importantly, I spoke about courage and the courage to back yourself, to do things and as part of the entrepreneurial journey, right? So It was at a co-living, co-working space that was being hosted. And it was like 40 odd entrepreneurs. So a really good, vibrant group. I was due to go in at six o'clock and I left at a little bit after five. I went, I'm gonna go there, check out the venue, talk to some people. My gig's at six, happy times. I had my cousin here with me. She flew in from Greece. And so she'd been staying with me. And because we've got another event that we're running at the end of this week, uh, this weekend at the time of recording in a few days time. So I said, why don't you come along? So we, we got a taxi. I looked at it and it says it's about 15 minutes away. I, I wasn't sure about the train. I wasn't sure the best episode. I said, listen, I'm just going to catch a taxi. So the guy looked at the address and said, um, yeah, okay. I know where it is. Hop in. So we go in there, we're driving along and we get to this place and it doesn't look right. And he goes, here it is. And I go, are you sure dude? It doesn't look right. He goes, yeah, it is. It's, so it was a residential spot. He drops us off, heads out. And as he heads out, I ring on the doorbell, nothing, nothing, good. And a gut was going, this isn't the right place. This isn't the right place. So I sent a message to the other guy who was also speaking. And I said, I think I'm at the wrong place. What does it look like? He told me, I go, my worst fear was confirmed. And so I went, what do I do? And I saw this woman walking up this hill and it was a really steep hill. And this poor lady was huffing and puffing. And I saw her on her badge. Um, it said staff at a school member and I thought she speaks English. And we were middle of nowhere. And I asked her and I said, excuse me. First of all, do you have blessing? Bless you speak English? She said, yes, I do through huffing and puffing that she was, she was doing it. And I explained the situation. She said, no, this is, this is nowhere near that. come with me down to the school. So she's walked down the hill, back to where she's gone to the school. And this beautiful lady is really awesome. Gave me my details. She got the taxi and ordered a taxi for us, which is really awesome of her. And I felt really bad because I knew she had to go back up the hill again, right? But she was really, really kindhearted. So I know it's a drawn out process. There's a purpose to it. I'll get to it very quickly. And...

Oh no. Warpack.

And so we, and I also called the coworking place and said, listen, I'm running late. I don't know what's happened. They took me to a wrong place. And she said, that's okay. We'll rearrange the schedule. We'll get one of the leaders, one of the people here to come pick you up. I said, great. And then I had the scenario where the taxi and the person are both coming. And I said, I called the coworking place and said, please don't worry about bringing someone the taxi's coming. And then the taxi's meant to be in 10 minutes and 20, 25 minutes later. the guy's still not there. And I went, oh man, did I cancel the definite ride to go to the right thing? Did I basically stop one thing? Anyway, the taxi driver came, I gave him the address, he goes, no, this is not where it should be. And gave him the address, he goes, I'll tell you where it is. It took us, you know, he drove us another 20 minutes, dropped us off at another destination. And I go, where is it? He goes, look, it's somewhere around here. I went, I've got this horrible feeling again. And I called the co-working place. He goes, no, that's not it at all. You're still like two and a half kilometers away. And I went, so that's twice I got dropped off at the wrong spot. Mind you, my talk and talk until I was getting rescheduled and later and later. And finally, you couldn't get access to the car place from where we were dropped off. So we had to go through terrain and the bush to get there. We got met by someone who worked there halfway along, who escorted us through what felt like a goat track to get back to the co-working place.

Oh no.

And by then I was actually laughing because my cousin is with me. She goes, dude, how are you, how are you under pressure? And I go, I've reframed it in my mind. I've actually got material now, extra material for my talk. So I finally get there, I'm laughing and then people go on, why are you so laughing? I said, you know what? Here's the prequel to my story. This is what I was going to talk about, but I want to talk about this. I said, I started this journey two hours ago for a 15 minute trip. I got. dropped off not in the wrong place once, but twice. You know, I had to ask for help when I, you know, I had to overcome my doubt, shame, guilt and whatever. I finally got as far as I could possibly go. And then I had to ask for help. And I asked for help for someone who knew the past, the past I didn't know. I go, does that sound like entrepreneurship to you? And they suddenly went, bingo. And to me, I know it was a drawn out process, but that to me highlighted everything that you and I talk about, everything that

Nice. Nice.

could have derailed everything. And I said to them, how many of you and how many people would have given up? How many people would have given up after the first wrong address? I went too hard, inconvenient, I'm going home. And the second one, so it was a beautiful start to a talk that I then was able to carry on with what I wanted to talk about. But sometimes the gift is in the experience you don't even realize.

Hmm. Yeah, it's beautiful, man. It's beautiful. And I think that's what I got out of it. You know, the most important thing is, you know, make sure you try to get an Uber or just okay.

But he's ironic part about it is I said to him, now guys, how do I get home? And they said, all you got to do is walk down the bottom of this hill. It's five minutes. You get to a train station and then you're one stop from the train station from. So literally 15 minute walk. And then the part of me then went, why did I have to complicate that? What was I looking at? So there's so many tangential conversations that happen as a result of that. But.

Yeah. Simplicity.

Yeah, like to me, let's dissect this Lawrence, anything that you can pick out of that story you can go with. Let's go.

Yeah, listen, I think the most important thing that I took away from that is, I mean, we can talk about, you know, there's no talk about logistics, but I think the story is a story. So I think that the main thing that for me is that it's yes, it is entrepreneurship, it is about life. The key one takeaway that I got from is the mindset you actually had, you know, what was it's what Wabi Sapi is really about, like the essence of Wabi Sapi is that, you know, the attitude that you had carries the message or the the how you act and behave, right? Because when you can take on an attitude of laughter and you can take on, you know, shifting from frustration and irritation to curiosity and to acceptance, that in itself, you know, has a sliding door moment of two gyms, the angry gym, frustrated gym that could show up and then do this talk flustered, or the gym like you did, yes, you know, that. that came on and created a story and a great analogy that people resonated with. And you basically took that as part of material because that is part of life. And I think, you know, we have these sliding door moments at any given moment in our lives, you know, happens every single day of our life. And that is what's beautiful about that. But the only difference was the circumstances were the same. The only difference was the mindset of Jim, you know, and, you know, first in Jim Ager versus Jim B. And I think that is, that's killer. You know, like this is what... while we saw we've been about, we've been trying to talk about things like this is about the art of imperfection is to recognize that nothing is perfect, but it's how you deal with that, how you operate on a day-to-day basis. And this is a true life example of what goes on in our lives that can be applied that could change the trajectory of your life.

Yeah, and I can't, I can't hand on heart tell you that's how I would have responded every time, right? But whether it's life maturity, experiences, a couple of knocks on onto your backside, maybe it's the last 12 months of my life where nothing has gone to plan, that fortified me and just allowed me to go, hey man, just keep going, just find a way. You don't have to muscle through this. You don't have to get angry. It's about how do you still keep moving forward and...

Mm-hmm. Yep.

adapt, innovate, look at another strategy, ask for help. So it was really an experience around a journey, if that made sense.

Yeah, it's not easy. Like I'm not saying that we have it together that oh, we operate like this. Because it can sound like that. And I'm, thank you for correcting, not correcting, but like, you know, being honest about that. It's like, you don't operate like that all the time. Neither do I. And it's like, you know, yesterday, you know, you know, I got injured, you know, playing paddle pretty badly. My thumb is pretty bruised. And I remember feeling like there was two, like I had two voices in my head. Like one voice was saying, All right, let's see where the gift is. You know, like just accept like, what does this mean? And the other guy is going, shut up, it's fricking painful. Like, this is no lesson here, you know? He's like, he's yelling at me like, you're not gonna be playing for a long time. Well, look, you can't work out. Like, I was like, these two voices were inside my head. I'm like, oh, because that, but that's the truth, right? It's what you do in those moments. I'm not saying it's so easy to go on a park. It's like, yeah, I was definitely feeling like, oh, what's the great, hell no.

Yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, got it all under control. Everything's great. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

right? My emotion was like, this thing was throbbing. It was, you know, like, I was like, it was, I came home and, you know, all day, it was kind of like, you know, sulking, you know, my wife's like, you know, what's going on with you? Why so quiet? Because to me, like, that's my process, actually, for me. Yeah, to other people was my wife is probably sulking. But to me, I was like, I was just trying to process. I'm not, I'm trying to like, just deal with the emotion in my head by myself, because I'm like, just rational, not rational, may rationalize, but just

Yeah. Mm. Mm. Yeah. Yeah. Yep.

calmen the emotion now to not let it go one way or the other yet. Just like let me process the pain, let me process the grief, the loss of all the things I can't do for the next two to three weeks. But in a timely manner. I'm not that quick to just switch. I'm like, okay, I see all that. It takes time. It takes time for that. And I think that's the truth of how I process it. I'm sure I believe that that's sort of what you're saying too.

Yep. Yeah, 100% because like, don't get me wrong, there's things going to plan and you're in a zone and you get sideswiped by situations by life and how quickly you can regroup and steady the ship again, it will determine. So that doesn't mean that you're not gonna be thrown off your center or you're thrown off path or course. It's whether you use that situation as a trajectory to keep on that path or. What do you then do if you're in a skid? How do you get back onto control of the vehicle? So metaphorically speaking, and this is exactly what we're talking about. So I get it Lawrence and having spent some time with you and you know, what a part of you would be, I'm visualizing this heckle and hide situation should say where you've actually got, yeah, here's the gift, be grateful. I'm like, what are you talking about dude? I'm slipping in the rankings and I can't. So, but that's the component parts of all of us. that have to try and make sense. And yeah, I think what you're doing is actually authentic because if you can immediately go straight to gratitude without your truncating the true emotion, right? Is you're gonna be annoyed, you're gonna be frustrated, you're gonna be like, what a shame. And, but you have to cycle through it to then go, okay, now I'm ready to rebuild. And what I found sometimes is the, you know, the people who have really had things happen and they... They perpetuate the emotion with a happy, happy, happy look. It's like, dude, you're not happy. You're not actually being honest with yourself. You're inauthentic in what you're feeling. So it's right to be annoyed and pissed and hurt and frustrated. You've dedicated X amount of time here. Be connected, be true to your feelings. Allow them to cycle through you and then rebuild.

Yeah, because I think that, you know, we tend if we ignore what people tend to do sometimes, you know, is to ignore that and just go straight to what we're supposed to feel we're supposed to be doing, but not allowing that to be a gradual journey to get to that level. And by suppressing that emotion, you're really not listening to your true self. Because my belief is that the emotion that pops up is the true emotion and you can't, it's not like you, you, you go out of your way to feel it, but it's like,

Yeah. Yep.

Those are the feelings. Sometimes some things piss you off and some things you get angry and some things you get frustrated. You don't know why, but it just does. And this happens in relationships. And in a relationship, I just had a discussion with my wife recently. Certain things were irritating or just like it's frustrating me. I don't know why. It doesn't make any sense whatsoever. I don't feel good telling you this, but it does. If I don't say anything, right?

Yeah.

then I'm not really telling the truth. And we're not really building a strong relationship together by telling the truth to each other. And I even said that to her, like, I don't feel good telling you this because I feel like almost bad that I'm even saying this. But the reality is, is like, you know, this is happening and this is sort of, you know, frustrating me. And I don't know, I'm not asking you to solve it but I just want to let you know so that you understand my feeling. And I said, I can't control it, it just comes up.

Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Mm. Yeah.

And I think, I don't know, I hope that that's the way to do it, but that's how I see it is that by telling the truth, we can now have an authentic of it's been great because it's like she understands, you know, she understands that she also understands what, you know, that it's not, um, you know, like why I shouldn't feel this way, but at the same time she understands why I feel this way. So now we actually had a good conversation around that and go, what possibly could have triggered all of this stuff? And then now we can actually find and have, well, first of all, now we have awareness.

Yep.

And then now that we have awareness, we actually can now find ways to course correct that so that we can actually move on, so that we can build, be better. And I think that's what relationships are built upon, right? And today's talk is about putting it out there. Well, sometimes like putting it out there also means to your significant other. Like putting it out there to tell the truth to your partner. Like, this is what I like, or this is what I don't like. And here's the reason why. And if your partner is, you know, truly the person who's gonna be beside you, your best friend, your lover, you know.

Yeah.

they should not be feeling like guilty or judged or, you know, being, you know, like, you know, being attacked. It's like, they understand, they need to seek to understand. They might not understand initially, but to fully try to understand like, how can we grow together? And, and that's, that takes guts. Like that's what relationships about, right? It takes guts to put yourself out there. Um, even when you're first asking for the date, getting them to marry you, like all those things, it's just like, you're constantly putting yourself out there and that's a challenge, but we've got to keep that up.

Yep.

in order for the relationship to grow.

Yeah. I like what you said about the, the emotion and being, having an awareness around it. And a really big important thing that I've always found whenever, if I'm angst, if I'm experiencing angst or agitation, I try and name the emotion. You know, I quite often I've imagined that I'm like, what I'm actually feeling apprehension or I'm feeling. And what I found is that when I can name it and really nail it, I actually went a long way to be able to manage it and find a solution for it.

Hmm. Yeah.

Whereas a lot of the times if I had a tendency to suppress it and not get really in touch with what was going on, that was a tendency to, as you said, you might be abrupt or explode or something like that and necessarily say things and communicate with someone in a way that that's not how you would normally do it. And for me, what I realized is, yeah, the tendency would be quite often to suppress things and. So a big part for me was always, that's where I've used exercise a lot of the time because I've had the awareness to go, I need to communicate something, now is not the right time because I've got this built up of frustration or energy that's not really about the issue, it's about my stuff. I'm gonna go off and go for a run, hit a ball, kick a ball, do whatever, punch a bag. And then when I come back and I'm clearer, then we can talk about the issue as opposed to. the backlog because so many times when we're putting it out there, we're annoyed not about the person, but we've got backlog and we're just looking for anybody who can take that out on. And if it happens to be someone who is a significant person in your world, they're unfairly at the brunt of it and that's not really fair. So that's what I'm understanding from what you're saying there, Lawrence, in terms of just getting really connected with what's really going on for you will help you really solve that.

Yeah, and these continue to happen everywhere, you know, like in terms of our lives, you know, like we're just talking about the speaking engagements that we're going to be having and you know, the preparation for that and you know, the podcast, you know, shooting videos for, you know, all these things that you put out there, that's a really tough thing to go through. And these are the emotions and these are the feelings that we all have to kind of wrestle with. You know, we all have to kind of be challenged to override and this is an internal thing. It's not necessarily an external thing. It's not about... shooting the video is not about doing a podcast, it's not about speaking, it's about the emotion that you need to run through. And I started this podcast saying, the fear is always there. Should I press record? Should I press send? Should I post this? And it doesn't get easier. I don't find it. I'm not sure, maybe it does get easier over time, but there's always still, there's that monkey brain of like, are you sure about this? And to me, I think it's judgment, right? It's about, how do you deal with the judgment? I think before we get there, it's like, what do you do

Yeah.

to prepare yourself to put yourself on the line and putting material into the world.

I think that's a good point. I think it's for me, I really liked that because a lot of the times that I post, funny enough, I'm actually trying to get connected with self. So if I write something and I like to put the talk in the podcast, I actually really enjoy that. I find it really cathartic. We discuss things and we get off and go, gee, that really helped me. I hope someone listens to this, but if they don't, this was really helpful to me. I really, really got a lot out of this, right?

It's self-therapy, let's face it.

100%, 100%, the best coach job and the first coach job you'll ever do is one on yourself, right? So let's declare it that way. A lot of times if I get a really, a gut hit on whether I should do something. So if I feel like I need to write something, I get an inspiration to it. I don't try and force it, but I try and capture that essence and feeling. And then for me, if I am clear on that, if I go, is this my truth? Is this what I really feel? and I'm at peace with it, then I can release it into the world and it'll go where it needs to go. And irrespective, I've got no control over how it will be received. What I have control over is the essence with which I have it, my intended objective. And then from then on, yeah, it's a positive going, let's bring it to life and do that. I don't have a outcome. I don't have a bit by writing this, I'm hoping that I don't, it's not copywriting, which is a skill in itself. It's purely just I'm connected with my thoughts. I'm trying to organize them in a way that may make sense to me and hopefully somebody else. And then I let it go. And there's always that feeling of like, okay, what's my agenda here? Do I have an agenda? What am I trying to do? So there are all the questions that go through my mind, but I have to be at peace with it. Figuring that if in 25 years time, I happen to read that or the old, my grandmother reads it on the front page of the newspaper. would I be proud, ashamed, or would I still be able to maintain that position and look them in the face and say, that's exactly what I feel.

Interesting. You know, like I'm very similar in the process, but there's one thing that I kind of, what you said kind of triggered my thought around this, which is the truth of the matter is, is that the initial thought when I put something together, let's just say I'm putting a speech together or a presentation together or video or whatever it is. And oftentimes I'm just thinking about it. I've never actually said, I never actually verbalized it, but I feel like this is sort of how I process it. So I, you know, bear with me. I think one of the things that I do when I jot down a bunch of ideas, so I might prepare for talking about, okay, what's the theme of, you know, the conference? And then from that theme of the conference, I go, okay, like, what are some of the ideas? And just let it marinate. Like, I don't really kind of force it. I just kind of let it marinate, listen to a few things, and over time, something, what an idea will pop in, I'll just write that down. And then one of that, one seed will kind of grow and grow into many different ideas. And how do I put all these two or three ideas together now? And you know, the initial run through. you know, I'll be honest, it's, it comes through this perspective of going, how am I gonna look through this? Like, you know, how am I gonna look through this? It's all about me. It's, you know, like, am I gonna come out good? Look, sounding like, do I look, sound smart? Or do I sound like I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna come out stronger, you know, at the end, from a branding perspective or, you know, like how am I gonna look? And that's the truth of the matter. It's like, that's what the filter goes through my head. And I'm always usually,

Mmm. Yeah.

just right before, you know, the presentation, it didn't mean a day before, two days before, like it's happening this weekend actually. So it's like, I'm a couple of days before, I'm like, now I'm sitting in it, I'm like, yeah, I think this is all about you and not enough about them. And that's when it really hits me. I'm like, okay, this is where I completely rewrite everything or this is why I hate putting up, like, you know, when the convenience says many years slides before, you know, two or three days before.

Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I hate that because it's like, uh, I'm doing it on the plane last minute. I'm still working on it. Um, so anyway, so, so now like, I'm sort of seeing that space and going, you know, like, what is this really about? Sort of what you said, like, what is this really about? And, and if it's not about, let's, this feels like more is about me, like, not about me, it's about them as whoever the audience is, like, what do I really, how do I help and serve and create value for the audience?

Yeah. Mm-hmm.

And inevitably that's when things start to shift. That's when I kind of like let go of my own ego, let go of my thing, and it just becomes more about them. And I think by doing so, two things happen. Like one, I'm not attached to the outcome now. You know, whether people like it or not, it's like, well, it doesn't matter because the right intention was right for me.

Yep. Yep. Hmm, yep.

You know, so I think that's number one. And two, I think the speech becomes, it hits harder. It hits, it resonates and aligns with people because they can feel the energy that whatever I'm gonna talk about is, I had no intention of making me myself look good. I'm just here to help you grow. And it might just be one person in that room that resonated and not everybody else. It doesn't really matter. Cause like, again, for the first point, I'm unattached to that outcome.

Yeah, I think that's a great thing because you can have an intention or an outcome that you would hope people would have. You'd have something that they will have a call to action or they'll be able to collate what your message is and the takeaway. So that's what you hope for. But you can't guarantee that. You can't force it. You can actually put the information and frame it in a particular way, give multiple perspectives, expand hopefully people's consciousness and then they can make their own conclusions. I want this person to hate it, like it. Will this challenge someone? Yeah, it probably will. But I think you've got to sit and go, okay, what's your intention? So, you know, I'll reflect back what you just said, Lawrence. And when I spoke to these entrepreneurs yesterday was about courage. And I've spoken about them before, I think in one of the podcasts. But one of the subsets of courage, when we hear about it, we think courage is bravery. That's the one we quite often associate with. but there are six different types of courage. And I outlined those to them. And the one you were talking about specifically is social courage. And social courage is the willingness to lean into the situation where you have to communicate a message, share something, run the risk that, okay, I feel intimidated. So for example, and you can be courageous in one area. For example, I may have physical courage, you may have physical courage by going and doing CrossFit. I'm going to Jiu Jitsu, doing whatever it is. But the social courage to get me up to sing on America or Australia's Got Talent, no chance. I go to water, you know? And so it actually, or it's the same social courage that you talk about that a writer writes a song or someone writes a book. And you talk back in the days before you hit send on an email, you have to package it and put them in an envelope.

Mm. Mm-hmm. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I remember talking to a friend of mine that they reckon that was the most vulnerable moment in their whole life. That this person, she had children. Uh, she had a whole lot of things. She had a complicated birth where every, um, basically obstetrician in training came in for this was a training opportunity. She's, I felt less vulnerable than when I put the manuscript to my book into the non-below and said, here's, here's who I am.

Yeah. Hmm. Yeah, it's a powerful thing. Thank you for bringing that. I never heard that before, but yeah, you're absolutely right. And especially when you're an entrepreneur and you're running a business, that social courage, it's important, right? Because it's required in today's age to really put that, to be on social, to kind of get out there.

Fascinating, right? Mm.

Although you don't want it to make it about yourself sometimes in not all cases But sometimes you are the spokesperson you are the face of the company and you do need to kind of do that And also too is not just the social pressure of not social pressure but social courage to do that to in the public eye But you also have to have sort of courage within your own team You know for you to be out there and to be able to go because they're following you you're Lee if you're a leader in the team

Yep.

If you're not going out there to promote your product or your thing, how on earth are they going to feel uncomfortable to do that to the same? And so there's that, you know, when it challenges everybody, I think it for everybody who does a podcast or video or marketing channel, like, and you got to put your stuff out there. It's, it's difficult. And, and that's the thing. That's why we want to talk about this because it's difficult for everybody. And I hope that what that does is that when you realize that it is difficult for everybody, then it makes you. part of the team, part of the tribe, part of the society of that this is how it is, and you do it anyways. And that's how we're gonna be able to provide that confidence and courage is because, you know, you start getting feedback and you also start doing it anyways.

Yeah. And some people, particularly in the entertainment industry, they find something within themselves. They adopt an alter ego that allows them to access those characteristics and traits. So that's how they do that. And so quite often, you talk to a lot of people who are performers on stage, actually really, basically they're not extroverts, they're introverts. But they find, you know, they find something within themselves. And I think you said something earlier on, which really hit the home for me too, is that When you're making it about you, you can get nervous, you can get challenged, you can get muddled up in what you're saying. But when you actually go, who am I here to serve? Who's here to hear this message? And you make it about them, it elevates you outside of yourself and you're then able to communicate what we, in chiropractic we always said innately with, you know, you can have inspiration in the moment to go whichever direction you need to go because you get to read on the situation because you know, that you will say something that someone needs to hear. But if you're making it all about you, you get nervous, you get tongue tied. And that's the biggest thing that I've noticed in myself, especially in doing the podcast as well too, is when I can surrender and let go of how I'm performing, how I'm doing, more of my essence comes through and you actually get a more authentic experience. And so consequently, it's, we're then able to have a communication rather than me. second guessing myself about, hang on, did that sound right or what have you.

Well, this leads to why we even get, why do we have that fear in the first place anyways, right? And the fear is usually just purely judgment. And that's the thing we have to face head on. It's like, it's the judgment of others. And the example of today, I'm gonna use this example, because I'm super proud of him. And my son today of all days, right? We're doing this topic when Jim suggested it was like, he's, at that school, they have something called TASASpeaks and the speaking thing is basically a, Basically, everybody has to do a speech on a particular topic, on a particular theme, and they have to write their own speech. They have to present in their class. And out of each year, there's three classes. And out of their, everybody presenting, each class provides a top three in each class. And then, so he made it to that semifinals. And then from there, the top three, so there's nine of them now in that year, they present to everybody in the year, and then they pick one from each class. So then he makes the top one. So they now is the top three in the year. So now they have to go in front of the whole school, right? and then present that speech in front of the whole school. And the reality is that I'm super proud of him. He did an amazing speech and he did an Aussie slang and how slang affects culture was awesome, it's great. And it's so funny to see because he didn't win. Okay, so as a father, yes, I know, it's easier for me to say he should have won, but honestly. he really should have won. Like, I can't tell if he should have won. No offense to any of the other parents, me and the child. But I think it's one of those things where it's, it's in its sport, I guess, in a way, that it's judged by a judge. No different than gymnastics or diving. You know, every sport has a referee. There's always judgment calls. And sometimes it doesn't go your way. But that's the thing that we're talking about here, right? It's like, when we put it out there, right? It's easy not to put it out there so we don't ever get judged.

Mm-hmm.

But if you're gonna put yourself out there, you have to realize that you are gonna be judged, right? Whether you like it or not. And sometimes the judgment that comes your way is may not be the one you want. And what I had to kinda talk through him today was, and I'm probably subsequent always to continuous list over the next few days is to recognize that, hey, life isn't sometimes that you're not gonna be chosen. Sometimes it doesn't go your way.

course.

Even though you give him all your best, you gave your heart out, he did. He gave his all heart out. And sometimes it's the judgment of three or four people on the panel that didn't like it, even though the hundreds of other people loved it. The amount of feedback he got from teachers. And, but he didn't go his way from four people. And then, the lesson I taught him, like, listen, at the end of the day is you gotta listen to, you don't worry about it, don't listen to the opinion of three or four people. Like, listen to the feedback that you've been getting from all your friends and other teachers who, really felt that you should have won. Those are the people you should be listening to and create that story. Not to think, oh, I've done my best and I didn't even go through it, maybe I'm not good enough. Like that's easy, right, for that to create that story. It's hard for a 12 year old kid to kind of go through that process. But I guess what I'm saying to you, I hope that I can relate that story to everybody else is just that you're gonna be judged. That's why we put it out there. But you have to face the judgment. But it's what you do with that judgment. Do you have to listen to the judgment? And that's your decision. and as we talked about behavior and attitude, that's the thing, like you can be judged, but you don't have to take the feedback. And I love Seth Godin when he talks about this, and when he releases a book, and he's like, no one has ever written a better book because of their one-star review. Right, and it's like, it's so true. Like we, anybody who puts out, always look at the reviews. And what do we do? We never look at the five-star reviews. We're like, oh, this is great. No, we look for the one person who gave us a one-star review and want to listen to what they said. But.

Yeah. Yep.

In honesty, that person, that review, just means one thing. It just wasn't for them. It doesn't mean anything about how good or great your work was or wasn't. And I think that's the important kind of lesson.

Yeah, yeah, that, yeah, I like that because that's right. You're not going to be everything to everybody. And I think this is, it's a really interesting point is that if you, particularly when you get on stage, particularly when you start running, writing a podcast, recording a podcast or writing something, if you're really connected to what you are, you're going to attract the people who it resonates with and not necessarily. because they'll agree with you, but they'll appreciate your style, how you go about things. And the biggest thing and lesson that I learned is that being vanilla or trying to appeal to everybody meant that you were disenfranchising the majority of the people, because they never really knew where you stood. It was better to have people who go, I love what you're saying, I dislike passionately what you're saying and be okay with that, rather than actually going, I'll give you a little bit of this, a little bit of that. which is not really anything that I believe in. So just to keep everybody semi-happy, to me that's a recipe for not being authentic, you know? And he talked about judgment before. I think that there's two parts of judgment that I always find too is that if you are worried about being judged, there's a part of you that is actually judging yourself. It could be yourself, it could be other people, but a really pivotal... moment or pivotal area of forming that is getting awareness of like, where am I judging myself? Where am I doing it? Don't worry about what everybody else is doing. What am I doing to myself? And if I'm judging myself as I'm not blah, I'm not this, I'm not that, or I'm this, or I am that, you're judging yourself left, right and center. And then whatever little thing that I'm understanding you're saying, leave a little one-star review will have a disproportionate impact on you because you're already just taking the big stick to yourself first.

That's right. That's right. And it's, you know, it's judgment on yourself is the most critical thing that we actually have full control over. Right? Whereas the judgment of others we have no control over. We only have somewhat of an influence maybe and most of the time we have no influence on all. But how you process yourself, which we started with the progress of a mindset and the attitude like that you can change. Doesn't mean it's easy. It's still hard, right? You still got to dampen that monkey brain, but it's, it's, it starts there and that dictates and changes the attitude. change the story you write about yourself or think about yourself, which then affects multiple times on how you're gonna behave and act in the future. And so that's, you know, and that's the thing that we all have to fight against. When you're putting yourself out there on the line, and when you're putting out there and stand in front of a stage to talk about something, guarantee you're gonna feel this imposter syndrome that we talked about, you know, previously. It's about this feeling of like just not knowing enough or who am I to stand up here and say this. The reality is that these are all the self-talk that we have to kind of navigate and we have to go through and you have to find it within yourself. You talked about the alter ego. That's why we have a Beyonce. Like a Beyonce was a church singer who's quiet, introverted, and she created Sasha Fierce, someone who is like sexy and loud and who is not a church going choir singer. We would never have gotten Beyonce. if she didn't find such a fierce within herself. For those of you who don't know, such a fierce was her alter ego within herself to find. And those are the things that are so important to kind of attach, to find that within each and every single one of us. We have to find our alter ego, someone who can believe in us. And we talked about courage before, you talk about like strength, courage, and doing something risky too. I think there's also a pathway sometimes to find courage from one area and translate it to another area. And it's because you've already have experienced it already in one area, one aspect. You know, you got to find that courage and go, how do I translate it to my social courage? Or how do I translate it to my relationship courage? Like all of these things are all within us. It's a matter of just shifting and learning and then growing and then developing that courage.

Yeah. Yep. Yeah, totally. And I was actually one of the questions I got asked yesterday was, okay, you outline six areas. I have two that I do very comfortably. What do I do with the first four? And I just said, look, one of the simplest easiest ways to lean into your courage, whatever that is, whatever that action step is, it doesn't have to be a massive rip at the band-aid off type of a step, but just lean into it. And if Emotional courage is one of those. If not communicating what you really feel is your greatest fear, and you don't want people to know what's going on for you because you don't want them to know, hey, I'm struggling here. The first step may be to journal it, to get connected with self, because that's not as threatening as going off there and letting everybody else on a social platform know what's going on. It's actually being true to self. So that quite often is a starting point. From there, you may then go, hey, who am I? closest people that I can just say, hey listen, I'm, I'm going through some, some challenges here. Can we have a conversation? So that's how it starts. You don't go from zero to home run straight away. You actually, but you have to be prepared to go at bat and swing and start and lean into whatever it is that's terrifying you to be able to overcome it.

I don't want to put you on the spot here, Jim, but I think it'll be due to service to the listeners that the listeners are probably thinking right now, because what are the six courage that we're supposed to have? So if you can remember them, I...

Yep. Okay. You know what? I'll definitely, I'll definitely do it, but how about we, we do a proper podcast episode on it because that would be really great. But just for, for, yep. Yeah. So you've got physical courage, you have physical courage. I'll just name them. You've got social courage. You've got moral courage. You've got emotional courage. You've got intellectual courage, and you've also got spiritual courage.

Sure. But at least name them. Name them just for completion. Mm-hmm. Mmm. Mm-hmm. I love it. Okay.

So I will expand on those perhaps if we can have another podcast episode and really, really go, it's a teaser. Yeah. You don't want to miss out, but honestly, like what was really powerful about this presentation and talk is that every one of them, you know, you go into a, do a talk with, with entrepreneurs, they're interested in how can I do what I do better, what chips, what gold nuggets can you give me? And so for me to turn this, it's flawed them. All right. Because I'm suddenly going, look, it's not necessarily what more you need to do, but it's like,

It's a teaser. It's a teaser.

Where do you lean into and where do you lean into your moral courage? So you could be making a basically a whole lot of money in one area, but you know in yourself that you're violating a moral value for yourself. So what's going to happen? It's not going to end well for you. Right. Either you'll sabotage it or you're going to be disconnected to self and other people. So, you know, and more than one of people went, Holy smoke, that really helped because. Now I know why I had this guilt around my success because on a values level, I felt it was wrong to benefit from something. So I'm gonna now, and one guy said, I'm gonna re-change my model, my business model, to be able to be more in alignment. So I'm congruent, so I'm happily achieving and doing good things and not hurting people rather than having that torment itself. So we can definitely do another podcast episode of it. but it's huge, it really is. So that's why we think of courage in terms of bravery, but it's not that at all. There's so many avenues that we can definitely explore.

Okay, that's great. That's definitely something on the topic. I love that, those six. And I love the distinction that courage is separated in different categories. Because I have felt, to be honest with you, where I've, you know, I have courage in these areas, like, you know, I have courage and how come I don't have courage there? But it makes more sense that, you know, it's spread out into different varieties of columns. So let's kind of complete this podcast here. Like, so we're talking about putting it all out there. What other tips or last you know, putting it out there or maybe words of encouragement.

A good question is I always think of being prepared. One of my coaches always said, be prepared to be lousy. And by that saying, not put out sub-rate or sub-standard work, but just be prepared to put it out there. Your first draft or your first effort may not always be your best effort, but be okay with that. It's then going, okay, what do I learn? How can I improve? How can I get better? to accelerate it. So we've talked about elements of this in the past where if you're bound by perfectionism and you think that everything's gotta be perfect before you pull the trigger and get started, you'll never get started. So to me, leaning into the fear and being okay with the fact that, hey, I started, I put myself out there, I leant into the resistance or that pushback that was stopping me from even starting, I jumped there and you know, So many people don't even get past that point. So the moment that you're there, you're on your way, as long as you just keep showing up and you're taking the loose things and going again and again and again, that actually you'll dissipate. You'll get power and control over your fear because you're normalizing what leaning into that feels like.

Yeah, I think there's two things there. That one is the resistance you kind of mentioned. The resistance, I think it's a clue that there's probably something there on the other side. There's a saying, obviously the obstacle is the way. Ryan Holiday wrote a great book on that. And that's the thing is, when you feel that resistance, that obstacle, maybe consider that there's something, probably something innately telling you that it's worth it, it's worth doing. So that's one.

Run highs, yeah.

I think that the last thing I want to kind of, and you know, to kind of summarize all of this too, as well, it's like, it's the journey, right? This is the journey that you're looking for. And there's sort of what you kind of go on, you know, what you just sort of said, Jim, but it's mostly focusing on the journey to not get caught up in the comparison game. We discussed this many times in other podcasts, but it's so easy to not get started simply because you're trying to be, you know, the next, you know, fill in the blank, you know, video, you know, YouTuber or. entrepreneur or you know founder or whatever like you trust you you're jumping too many steps we don't compare ourselves to the beginning of when they first started and we all start somewhere and You know we also got to remember that and we got to not compare ourselves You don't get inspired by them, but don't have to like your first video I can this goes much of small things right you know when you do your first video Like everybody's trying to go like, oh, that's terrible. Of course it's terrible. It's supposed to be terrible. Like if you're that naturally gifted, like what were you doing? Like why weren't you be shooting videos, right? And the second one's gonna be just as crap. You know, so is your third, so is your fifth, so is your 50th. It probably takes you hundreds of, you know, and thousands of hours before you really get really good at it. The thing is that if you don't start, if you don't try, it's not gonna get any better. And you know, and we all talked about this many times is that

it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep, yep, yep. Yeah. Yeah.

that resistance that you constantly falling for is what's stopping you from living the life that you actually want. And I think that's, think about that for a second. This is the regret you're gonna have is because you never got started. There's so many things I regret not doing because I just regret not starting. And I know that when you start adding to that, whether for us moving, for example, it might seem easy to move and move countries and drop everything. Yeah, but that's because we've...

Yeah. Yeah.

I've kind of done it before, you know, and the first time was hard, and the second time was hard, and the third time was hard, but it got a little bit easier. And the same thing with podcasts. With each episode, we're getting a little more comfortable, you know, with each video that I put out, I get a little more comfortable, and it's been like 10 years. You know, I've been doing this for like 10 years, and it's still, I'm still searching for, you know, the improvements, where can I get better? But that's the process, that's trusting the process. And I think when you put yourself out there, the hardest part is lift off.

Hmm. Hmm.

the very first one. And once you do that, things doesn't mean it's getting easier, but it does, you know, obviously it's a little easier, but I think the hard part is that is the first step. And once you get past that first step, the second, third steps will become, you know, it's just a little bit smoother. So that's the, I hope that you took something away from this and reality is, you know, we'll love to hear your feedback. I'd love to, you know, send us some Q and A's or, you know, through Spotify or, you know, wherever you listen to this, send us some comments.

Hmm. Hmm.

and ask some questions because we'll love to, you know, maybe do a podcast where we can answer some of your questions or maybe do a podcast of the topics that you suggested. So please do that. See us on YouTube, Facebook, wherever you are. Please give us a rating, give us your comments because we'll love to hear from you and knowing that this is impacting you and your friends and family somehow, some way. Until next time, we'll see you on the next episode of Wabi Sabi.

Bye bye.